Class A Rankings 1-15-12

[HShockeywatcher]

Not much movement this week; no teams added, but there are some bubble teams who will be looking to get added in the coming weeks.

I bumped Breck ahead of St Thomas after the holiday tournaments because of their win over Lakeville South while all of St Thomas' games against top opponents were losses. Since then the win over Lakeville South is seeming less impressive and Breck lost to a team lower than two of the teams St Thomas lost to by more than St Thomas has lost any of their games.
All that being said, everything is just speculation at this point as they have both beaten all their common opponents. A week from today we will see who is really the top team and will likely be the top seed at state.

1. St Thomas Academy (9-3) [5-0]
The Fire were missing the best freshman forward in the state, so beating them out means very little, but scoring a bit while shutting them out is never a bad thing. The same day they beat HF, Breck lost by 2 to Moorhead, so St Thomas edges out the top spot just slightly. This week the Cadets host Shattuck, who they played well against last year in Faribault, who will hopefully prepare them well to travel to play Breck away and next week we will know for sure who is the top team in the state.
This week: Tues vs North St Paul, Wed vs Shattuck-St Mary’s, Sat @ Breck

2. Breck (11-1) [7-0]
Breck finally plays a truly top team and, while they played close and scored, they ended up losing. Moorhead is not quite the team either Edina nor East are this year and St Thomas lost to both of the by less. Not the best way to determine who’s better, but for now that’s all we have, until this coming Saturday. Hopefully it is a great game against the Cadets on Saturday.
This week: Tues @ St Paul Como Park, Thurs @ St Paul Johnson, Sat vs St Thomas Academy

3. Hermantown (15-0) [10-0]
Hermantown beat Grand Rapids better than East did, so they are obviously a top team, but they continue to struggle against another lower ranked team. Superior is another team they only beat by a goal the first time around at home and they play in Superior on Tuesday; can they show us the first meeting was an off game?
This week: Tues @ Superior, Thurs @ Ashland, Sat vs Bemidji

4. Duluth Marshall (11-6) [10-3]
The Hilltoppers have now played 4 of the other top 6 teams and they finally managed a win. A close win against Totino-Grace by a slightly smaller margin than EGF beat them (5-3 vs 5-2) but their body of works keeps them above the Green Wave. Playing a lesser opponent this week, the Toppers could fall a spot if EGF has a couple of home upsets.
This week: Fri @ St Paul Academy

5. East Grand Forks (11-3) [7-0]
Not much change here since last week; the Green wave beat a lower 8A team and a ND team by the same margin as in their first meeting. This will most likely be their toughest week of the regular season as they host both Roseau and Moorhead in what will be some great games. They will be playing both TRF and Warroad again in the next couple weeks.
This week: Tues vs Roseau, Thurs vs Moorhead, Sat @ Lake of the Woods

6. Totino-Grace (10-5) [8-4]
Two expected wins and a close loss to Marshall this week; the Eagles should not be a team for anyone to take lightly. They still play both of St Thomas Academy and Breck and most likely still control their own destiny with getting the top seed in section 4A.
This week: Thurs vs Irondale

7. Mahtomedi (9-6) [5-4]
The Zephyrs only loss by more than 2 goals is their 3 goal loss to Breck to open the season. Most likely the #3 seed in section 4A, no one would be surprised to see Mahtomedi make it back to the X this year as they have shown they can play with the top teams in class A and good teams in class AA.
This week: Tues vs Tartan, Thurs @ South St Paul

8. St Cloud Cathedral (10-4) [10-3]
The Crusaders are coming off a one goal road loss to the Hawks of Hermantown. With a good defense and good goalie, Cathedral just may be able to play with anyone they face this season. They should be able to roll through their next 9 games before they play Rogers and Marshall away in their last two games, with section, and potentially state seeding, implications on the line.
This week: Tues vs St Cloud Apollo, Sat @ Alexandria

9. Thief River Falls (11-3-1) [8-2]
Since their last meeting with Warroad, the Prowlers have been beat by Hermantown, shut out by Moorhead and beat four lesser teams. This week their game against Warroad is at home and a win would likely guarantee a top 2 seed in section 8A. After Warroad they play EGF and two Duluth teams next week, it should be an exciting next 4 games for the Prowlers.
This week: Thurs vs Warroad

10. Warroad (8-6-1) [5-4]
A close loss in Roseau and a win at home this week to prepare them for two good section 8 match ups. Can they avenge their home OT loss to TRF or manage to make the game with Moorhead competitive. Two great games this week; expect packed venues.
This week: Thurs @ Thief River Falls, Sat vs Moorhead

11. Rochester Lourdes (10-5) [8-3]
This may be too high, but a close loss to a Eau Claire team that is usually good is difficult to evaluate. Away against a good Chanhassen team this week before Delano next week. The Eagles aren’t looked at as a great team but 4 of their last 5 games are against Breck, Blake, Rogers and Totino, so they should be prepared for their games at state.
This week: Sat @ Chanhassen

12. Blake (9-6) [8-1]
The Bears allowed 4 goals to both Minnehaha and Hutch, which isn’t a great sign, but they did beat both Totino and Mahtomedi each by a goal early in the season, so we know they can play. They still have two remaining games against Breck and one against Lourdes, otherwise only conference games remain.
This week: Thurs vs Providence Academy, Sat vs St Paul Como Park

13. Delano (10-5) [6-5]
The Tigers were upset this week by conference and section foe Orono this week, but it would be tough to move them down much with how close they have played so many top teams. They will most likely end up the #3 seed in section 2A, but #2 is possible if they can finish the season well.
This week: Tues vs Litchfield, Fri @ Hutchinson

14. St Louis Park (9-4) [6-2]
The loss to Denfeld still doesn’t look good on their schedule, but aside from that all their losses have been against good competition, so they are tough to figure out. Being in section 2A is a real bummer for them as they are most likely looking at the #4 seed at best, possibly slightly lower.
This week: Tues @ Spring Lake Park, Fri @ St Paul Highland Park, Sat @ Minnehaha Academy

15. Rogers (9-5) [4-5]
The away loss to St Louis Park was a surprise, but since then the Royals have recovered well. They should be on a 9 game winning streak when they travel to Rochester to play Lourdes in just under under 4 weeks. They have shown they can play with good teams but are also susceptible to being upset; another upset and they will fall off the list.
This week: Sat @ Spring Lake Park


Section Standings if the season ended today
3A
Marshall (3-2)
New Ulm (1-1)
Luverne (1-1)
Hutchinson (1-2)

3A is a little hard to dissect at the moment. Marshall started the season 2-0 and their next three games were wins against the other 3 here. In their last 3 games, though, they have a loss to each of Luvernce and Hutchinson. If they beat New Ulm on February 2nd, I suspect they would get the top seed. New Ulm lost to Marshall the first meeting by 1, shutout Hutch, but plays a much difficult schedule than the rest. Hutchinson lost to Marshall and New Ulm, beat Marshall and play no more games against these three, but play a Wright Country schedule and have been doing well as of late. Luverne is lost to Marshall the first meeting but beat them the second time around. It’ll be interesting to see how the coaches vote.

6A
Alexandria (1-1)
Little Falls (1-1)
Fergus Falls (1-1)

Alexandria seems to be struggling a little as of late, with their loss to Fergus Falls in OT, but they should still get the top seed if they don’t have a major upset and beat Little Falls the second time they play, but with Little Falls winning their last 8 in a row, allowing 1 GAA in those games, I suspect they will be able to beat Fergus again [this time and home] and beat Alex the second time around.


State Seeding if Section Top Seeds Won Their Section Today
#1 St Thomas
#2 Breck
#3 Hermantown
#4 Duluth Marshall
(5) East Grand Forks
(6) Little Falls
(7) Rochester Lourdes
(8] Marshall

[Iranger33]

Nice rankings but I would say that Blake is ranked a little to high. I was able to watch them play and wasn't impressed. Their goalie is a little shaky, they have the one stud up front. Not a top 20 team.

Currently New Ulm has the top seed in section 3A. And between New Ulm and Hutch, Hutch probably has a tougher schedule, they play 6 teams in the top 25 this year.

[rainier]

Hermantown beats a good AA school 5-2 and Breck loses to a good AA school 5-3 yet Breck is still ranked ahead of them?

I watched both of those games and Hermantown handled Rapids and Breck got handled by Moorhead.

[pipersniper12]

Hermantown beats a good AA school 5-2 and Breck loses to a good AA school 5-3 yet Breck is still ranked ahead of them?

I watched both of those games and Hermantown handled Rapids and Breck got handled by Moorhead.

Agreed. Hermantown not only should be ahead of breck but they should be in the number 1 spot. They've earned it!!
1. Hermantown
2. St. Thomas
3. Breck

[rainier]

Hermantown beats a good AA school 5-2 and Breck loses to a good AA school 5-3 yet Breck is still ranked ahead of them?

I watched both of those games and Hermantown handled Rapids and Breck got handled by Moorhead.

Agreed. Hermantown not only should be ahead of breck but they should be in the number 1 spot. They've earned it!!
1. Hermantown
2. St. Thomas
3. Breck

I can live with STA being ranked #1 due to their losses being to top teams, but for Breck to still be ahead of Hermantown is lunacy. Moorhead and Rapids are very similar teams, Hermantown won soundly and Breck lost soundly, what more do you want?

[defense]

Alex has now lost two games to 6a contenders. Lf and ff have only lost once to them.
all things considered Little falls is in the lead with Fergus close behind and Alex in third. Apollo is still a serious consideration but Willmar is falling off, breck wahp is threatening to join the top 5 or6.

[defense]

Alex has now lost two games to 6a contenders. Lf and ff have only lost once to them.
all things considered Little falls is in the lead with Fergus close behind and Alex in third. Apollo is still a serious consideration but Willmar is falling off, breck wahp is threatening to join the top 5 or6.

[HShockeywatcher]

I was planning on waiting a few days to respond so I wouldn't have a bunch of different responses, but since there are many questions, I will give my responses here:

Nice rankings but I would say that Blake is ranked a little to high. I was able to watch them play and wasn't impressed. Their goalie is a little shaky, they have the one stud up front. Not a top 20 team.

Currently New Ulm has the top seed in section 3A. And between New Ulm and Hutch, Hutch probably has a tougher schedule, they play 6 teams in the top 25 this year.

I haven't seen them play, but they have beaten both Totino-Grace and Mahtomedi, #6/#7 on my list. I can see saying one is a fluke, but two is tough for that. Their wins don't look great, but they don't have any bad losses, so based on who else they have played, it's tough to say they are bad. Who would be the next in? Little Falls?

As for 3A, it's tough for me to say the top team should be a team whose one section loss is to the team you'd have a at #3. That being said, if New Ulm wins the rematch, I will have New Ulm in the driver's seat.

Hermantown beats a good AA school 5-2 and Breck loses to a good AA school 5-3 yet Breck is still ranked ahead of them?

I watched both of those games and Hermantown handled Rapids and Breck got handled by Moorhead.

Agreed. Hermantown not only should be ahead of breck but they should be in the number 1 spot. They've earned it!!
1. Hermantown
2. St. Thomas
3. Breck

I disagree; if all you care about is winning and not how it happens or who is happens against, then sure, Hermantown is #1. But if that were the case, we'd just line up the top 15 records and not look at anything else.

Most poll systems have Moorhead as a better team than Grand Rapids. Breck beat a Mahtomedi team that went to OT with Rapids.
Losing to a better [relatively speaking] team simply is not worse than beating a worse [relatively speaking] team.
If you like PageStat (which is likely to change after this week), Rapids and LS are similarly ranked and Breck beat LS.

Hermantown also has three 1 goal wins and a couple come from behind wins. Ultimately the goal is to win and it's possible anything is going on, so it's really hard to know much until teams play each other. There have been multiple times this season I've thought I was going to put Hermantown at #1 the following week but ended up not doing so because of how they played against a lower team.

Anyway, these are all my opinions, you don't have to agree, in fact the discussion of other opinions helps influence future rankings and helps all gain insight.

Alex has now lost two games to 6a contenders. Lf and ff have only lost once to them.
all things considered Little falls is in the lead with Fergus close behind and Alex in third. Apollo is still a serious consideration but Willmar is falling off, breck wahp is threatening to join the top 5 or6.

Like with 3A, I have a hard time at the moment saying that Alex is not at the top until they lose it. I'm guessing Little Falls will take it from them, but until that time, it's theirs to lose.

I'm not just looking at losses, but the wins too. Right now, these three are 1-1 against each other and it will pan out. That being said, if you are citing losses, how can you even consider Apollo, who has 4 section losses?


Anyway, my opinions; if you have any questions, just ask. Should be a good week of hockey; enjoy!

[defense]

Probably right on Apollo,I hadn't thought they felloff that much.
That said, Alex did lose to them. Shouldn't that be considered?

[GordonBombay99]

Probably right on Apollo,I hadn't thought they felloff that much.
That said, Alex did lose to them. Shouldn't that be considered?

I would still consider Apollo a contender but after the disappointing loss to Willmar and the terrible performance and loss to Sartell shows that Apollo still has a lot to work on, but at the same time hey also have beaten Alex and played both Little Falls and Fergus close. Time will tell with the Eagles but they have to figure things out real quick.

[Mite-dad]

I haven't seen them play, but they have beaten both Totino-Grace and Mahtomedi, #6/#7 on my list. I can see saying one is a fluke, but two is tough for that. Their wins don't look great, but they don't have any bad losses, so based on who else they have played, it's tough to say they are bad. Who would be the next in? Little Falls?

Actually no. Little Falls should be closer to #10.

[PuckRanger]

All I am going to say is that at some point, the big goose egg in the "L" column next to Hermantown has to come into play at some point.

Looking over there remaining schedule, it is highly possible that they will run the table. Half are gimme's and only 2 or 3 will probably be contested. If they go 25-0, will you still keep them ranked at #3 because a few of them are "closer" games?

I will also point out that STA is not ranked #1 in any of the other polls, including the computerized ones.

[blacklung]

Hermantown has won all their games so far.
STA struggled with South St. Paul, an un-ranked team.
Herm beat their common opponent Marshall more convincingly than either Breck or STA,
The HERM/Edina/GR relationship tells us something.

STA 1
So St Paul 0
Talk about struggling with a lower ranked team. So St Paul UN-RANKED.

Lets look at their common opponent Marshal.
Herm 5
Marshall 1

STA 4
Marshall 3 IN OT…

Breck 7
Marshall 5

Lets look at the relationship with Grand Rapids.
Edina 4
GR 3

Edina 3
STA 2

Herm 5
GR 2
Herm took care of Rapids convincingly. Edina only beat Rapids by 1, and Edina beat STA.

I read Watchers’s rankings with amusement, especially all the negative Hermantown stuff over the past 2 years.
As he has said in previous posts, he is a graduate of STA. While I appreciate his work,
as a Hermantown fan, I am aware of how he picks and chooses things that make STA look good and others,
especially, Herm look bad. I think Herm gets the short end because it is the only public school to challenge STA. In the end, when/if Herm and STA meet again, and I hope they do,
I believe Hermantown will come out on top this time. Below are the rankings I think are more accurate.

FOLLOW THE PUCK Class A rankings as of 1-15-2012.

1 Hermantown (5A) 15-0-0
2 Breck School (2A) 11-1-0
3 St. Thomas Acad (4A) 9-3-0
4 East Grand Forks (8A) 11-3-0
5 Duluth Marshall (7A) 12-5-0
6 Thief River Falls (8A )11-3-1
7 Blake School (2A) 9-6-0
8 Totino-Grace (4A) 10-5-0
9 Mahtomedi (4A) 9-6-0
10 St. Cloud Cathedral (5A) 10-4-0

[blacklung]

All I am going to say is that at some point, the big goose egg in the "L" column next to Hermantown has to come into play at some point.

Looking over there remaining schedule, it is highly possible that they will run the table. Half are gimme's and only 2 or 3 will probably be contested. If they go 25-0, will you still keep them ranked at #3 because a few of them are "closer" games?

I will also point out that STA is not ranked #1 in any of the other polls, including the computerized ones.

Last year it took State Champion Eden Prarie and Kyle Rau to score with only seconds left in OT to beat the Hawks. Not a word was written by watcher. He just talked about the close game/tie with the bad TRF team that took 3rd in state. I believe he will find some reason to keep them out of the #1 spot if at all possible. Close games, lesser teams etc...

[HShockeywatcher]

Hermantown has won all their games so far.
STA struggled with South St. Paul, an un-ranked team.
Herm beat their common opponent Marshall more convincingly than either Breck or STA,
The HERM/Edina/GR relationship tells us something.

STA 1
So St Paul 0
Talk about struggling with a lower ranked team. So St Paul UN-RANKED.

Lets look at their common opponent Marshal.
Herm 5
Marshall 1

STA 4
Marshall 3 IN OT…

Breck 7
Marshall 5

Lets look at the relationship with Grand Rapids.
Edina 4
GR 3

Edina 3
STA 2

Herm 5
GR 2
Herm took care of Rapids convincingly. Edina only beat Rapids by 1, and Edina beat STA.

I read Watchers’s rankings with amusement, especially all the negative Hermantown stuff over the past 2 years.
As he has said in previous posts, he is a graduate of STA. While I appreciate his work,
as a Hermantown fan, I am aware of how he picks and chooses things that make STA look good and others,
especially, Herm look bad. I think Herm gets the short end because it is the only public school to challenge STA. In the end, when/if Herm and STA meet again, and I hope they do,
I believe Hermantown will come out on top this time. Below are the rankings I think are more accurate.

FOLLOW THE PUCK Class A rankings as of 1-15-2012.

1 Hermantown (5A) 15-0-0
2 Breck School (2A) 11-1-0
3 St. Thomas Acad (4A) 9-3-0
4 East Grand Forks (8A) 11-3-0
5 Duluth Marshall (7A) 12-5-0
6 Thief River Falls (8A )11-3-1
7 Blake School (2A) 9-6-0
8 Totino-Grace (4A) 10-5-0
9 Mahtomedi (4A) 9-6-0
10 St. Cloud Cathedral (5A) 10-4-0

Wow, that's a pretty packed post. Lots of accusations, pretty amusing.

PuckRanger, in 2008, the D1 football season ended with the only undefeated teams at #6 and #9 with two teams that had losses playing in the title game. Like it or not, it's not simply about winning, it's about who you beat and how you beat them.

What "negative stuff" have a said about Hermantown over the last two years? Are you talking about how last year during the state tournament I predicted they'd be the team to beat this year? Are you talking about how I moved them up from 3 to 2 in my initial rankings because of my opinion of them?

Nice little trick with the scores; look, I can do it too:
Herm 2
SCC 1

Roch 4
SCC 1

and

DE 5
STA 4

DE 6
Tonka 2

Okay, so St Thomas is the #2 team in state and Hermantown is on the outside of the top 10 in Class A? No and no.
One game doesn't make a season nor do score comparisons like that work.

So, you start off to say that St Thomas struggled against South St Paul then you say that Hermantown is the only public school to challenge STA? Does that mean you admit there was a hot goalie in the game the Cadets outshot the Packers 49-22? Either that, or the hatred you are imagining isn't actually there?

I never got a response from anyone on the board [or in PMs] about what they didn't like about me using LPH to start my rankings this year along with any of the past years. Now I guess the Hermantown picking and choosing games to make Hermantown look really good makes more sense.

Take a look at the in depth statistics of last year's teams that both PuckRanger and I did a little over a month ago:
http://www.ushsho.com/forums/viewtopic. ... 3&start=25
Take from it what you will.

Sorry for giving my opinion. I was called a complete tool in another thread for having the same opinion as karl
To quote myself from the initial post:

All that being said, everything is just speculation at this point as they have both beaten all their common opponents.

[rainier]

Hermantown has won all their games so far.
STA struggled with South St. Paul, an un-ranked team.
Herm beat their common opponent Marshall more convincingly than either Breck or STA,
The HERM/Edina/GR relationship tells us something.

STA 1
So St Paul 0
Talk about struggling with a lower ranked team. So St Paul UN-RANKED.

Lets look at their common opponent Marshal.
Herm 5
Marshall 1

STA 4
Marshall 3 IN OT…

Breck 7
Marshall 5

Lets look at the relationship with Grand Rapids.
Edina 4
GR 3

Edina 3
STA 2

Herm 5
GR 2
Herm took care of Rapids convincingly. Edina only beat Rapids by 1, and Edina beat STA.

I read Watchers’s rankings with amusement, especially all the negative Hermantown stuff over the past 2 years.
As he has said in previous posts, he is a graduate of STA. While I appreciate his work,
as a Hermantown fan, I am aware of how he picks and chooses things that make STA look good and others,
especially, Herm look bad. I think Herm gets the short end because it is the only public school to challenge STA. In the end, when/if Herm and STA meet again, and I hope they do,
I believe Hermantown will come out on top this time. Below are the rankings I think are more accurate.

FOLLOW THE PUCK Class A rankings as of 1-15-2012.

1 Hermantown (5A) 15-0-0
2 Breck School (2A) 11-1-0
3 St. Thomas Acad (4A) 9-3-0
4 East Grand Forks (8A) 11-3-0
5 Duluth Marshall (7A) 12-5-0
6 Thief River Falls (8A )11-3-1
7 Blake School (2A) 9-6-0
8 Totino-Grace (4A) 10-5-0
9 Mahtomedi (4A) 9-6-0
10 St. Cloud Cathedral (5A) 10-4-0

These rankings are based much more in reality. Rankings always have a "what have you done for me lately" component, and Hermantown has been the most impressive lately.

[HappyHockeyFan]

HSHW, your rankings are terrible, give it up....seriously...

[puckster15]

If the rankings are terrible then don't read them or go on the forum.

In our great state of hockey, you could probably be safe to say that any top 5 AA team could beat each other or any top 5 A team could beat each other. That is what makes HS hockey the greatest sport.

Some great hockey games this Saturday for both classes, with top 5 teams playing each other. Enjoy them.

[HShockeywatcher]

I can live with STA being ranked #1 due to their losses being to top teams, but for Breck to still be ahead of Hermantown is lunacy.

These rankings are based much more in reality. Rankings always have a "what have you done for me lately" component, and Hermantown has been the most impressive lately.

So which is it? Is St Thomas #1 or are they #3?
What they have done lately is beat Cathedral 2-1.
What St Thomas has done lately is shut out HF 8-0.

A little more food for thought:
SOS from PageStat
#21 St Thomas (19.15) like playing TG or CDH
#36 Breck (18.27) like Eastview
#55 Hermantown (17.08] like Denfeld

Still not sure why someone having an opinion that a certain team is the 3rd best team in the class is some sort of an insult. They're a great team and I never said they're not the best team, they very well may be. Based on what I've seen, what I've been told from multiple people and what the stats indicate, I don't think they are as good as Breck or St Thomas. It's amusing seeing people pick and choose which stats/game results to use to make a point, but then simply ignore when the same logic says something else.

Anyway, thanks to those of you with the constructive criticism and helpful comments about the teams on the list. Have a good week.

[PuckRanger]

PuckRanger, in 2008, the D1 football season ended with the only undefeated teams at #6 and #9 with two teams that had losses playing in the title game. Like it or not, it's not simply about winning, it's about who you beat and how you beat them.

Apples and oranges...

First, its prime time college football, not high school hockey, the game is played differently and many different factors are involved (not the least of which is $$$).

Second, the D1 college football system is the butt of all jokes when it comes to picking a champion, there is little credibility with that. Its no secret that is not a popular system. There are not enough ties between conferences to accurately determine things as we have here in hockey.

Third, its a lot tougher winning 25 straight games as opposed to a dozen games.

To me, wins and losses count the MOST, that is the main point of playing the game - not to win a season long goal differential contest. Coaches don't worry about their ranking when deciding whether to play a 4th line with a 3 or 4 goal lead or changing goalies - which might lead to a closer final score in a game they likely have in hand. In my opinion, you are over-analyzing things (probably in an effort, whether it be consciously or not, to reason your Cadets into the top spot week after week). It would be different if Hermantown played a schedule like that of Ely or Silver Bay, but they do not. All of the top 3 have their tough games and all 3 have their cake games. If all of the top 3 were undefeated, I would agree with most of what your saying, but they are not. Whether your aware of it or not, you have used the same arguments both for STA and then against Hermantown more than once. Its harder than it looks to remain unbiased.

One of the things that makes a team great is they find a way to win, even if they are having an off night. Hermantown has found a way to win 15 straight times, STA has failed in that regard 3 times.

Also, it does help to see them all play a couple times against quality opponents, and I have. I've seen Hermantown 4 times, STA 3 times, and Breck twice. Without a doubt, Hermantown is the most impressive class A team I've seen this year. Trying to rank solely on paper is difficult, which is why coaches and media are involved in LPH's ranking system.

By the way, Cathedral was missing some key players early in the season including the games your using... they were in the lineup against Hermantown, so be careful with that comparison.

[rainier]

I can live with STA being ranked #1 due to their losses being to top teams, but for Breck to still be ahead of Hermantown is lunacy.

These rankings are based much more in reality. Rankings always have a "what have you done for me lately" component, and Hermantown has been the most impressive lately.

So which is it? Is St Thomas #1 or are they #3?
What they have done lately is beat Cathedral 2-1.
What St Thomas has done lately is shut out HF 8-0.

A little more food for thought:
SOS from PageStat
#21 St Thomas (19.15) like playing TG or CDH
#36 Breck (18.27) like Eastview
#55 Hermantown (17.08] like Denfeld

Still not sure why someone having an opinion that a certain team is the 3rd best team in the class is some sort of an insult. They're a great team and I never said they're not the best team, they very well may be. Based on what I've seen, what I've been told from multiple people and what the stats indicate, I don't think they are as good as Breck or St Thomas. It's amusing seeing people pick and choose which stats/game results to use to make a point, but then simply ignore when the same logic says something else.

Anyway, thanks to those of you with the constructive criticism and helpful comments about the teams on the list. Have a good week.

I can buy putting STA ahead of Hermantown given their tough schedule, but after watching Breck-Moorhead and GR-Hermantown, putting Breck ahead of Hermantown makes no sense. Breck should be #3, and STA and Hermantown can be #1 and #2.

HSHW, your rankings are your opinion, and your opinion seems to be overwhelmingly in the minority.

[elliott70]

Watcher has a built in bias.
A recent STA grad.
Also, a private school bias.
Also, lack of seeing games other than teams that played against STA, and now some games in the Duluth area.
He is also very young with virtually no hockey experience.

BUT, he does do research and he does a decent summary.
His logic (as viewed by some) may be biased and flawed, but the effort is what counts AND he gives us fodder to generate discussion.

Bottom line, he helps make all this fun, so keep it up Watcher.
(And to thet critics, keep it up, also.)

[blacklung]

Great posts puckranger!, rainier! and elliott!. Puckranger you really nailed it.
I let his bias go unchecked last year, but just could not this year.

Below, new Hub rankings:

Hockey Hub
Class 1A
January 16, 2012
Rank Team Prev.
1 Hermantown (15-0-0) 2
2 Breck (11-1-0) 1
3 St. Thomas Ac. (9-3-0) 3
4 Dul. Marshall (12-5-0) 4
5 E. Grand Forks (11-3-0) 5
6 Th. River Falls (11-3-1) 6
7 Totino-Grace (10-5-0) 8
8 St. Cloud Cath. (10-4-0) 9
9 Mahtomedi (9-6-0) 7
10 Roch. Lourdes (9-4-0) 10

[blacklung]

Third, its a lot tougher winning 25 straight games as opposed to a dozen games.

To me, wins and losses count the MOST, that is the main point of playing the game - not to win a season long goal differential contest. Coaches don't worry about their ranking when deciding whether to play a 4th line with a 3 or 4 goal lead or changing goalies - which might lead to a closer final score in a game they likely have in hand. In my opinion, you are over-analyzing things (probably in an effort, whether it be consciously or not, to reason your Cadets into the top spot week after week). It would be different if Hermantown played a schedule like that of Ely or Silver Bay, but they do not. All of the top 3 have their tough games and all 3 have their cake games. If all of the top 3 were undefeated, I would agree with most of what your saying, but they are not. Whether your aware of it or not, you have used the same arguments both for STA and then against Hermantown more than once. Its harder than it looks to remain unbiased.

One of the things that makes a team great is they find a way to win, even if they are having an off night. Hermantown has found a way to win 15 straight times, STA has failed in that regard 3 times.

Also, it does help to see them all play a couple times against quality opponents, and I have. I've seen Hermantown 4 times, STA 3 times, and Breck twice. Without a doubt, Hermantown is the most impressive class A team I've seen this year. Trying to rank solely on paper is difficult, which is why coaches and media are involved in LPH's ranking system.

By the way, Cathedral was missing some key players early in the season including the games your using... they were in the lineup against Hermantown, so be careful with that comparison.

[TTpuckster]

Watcher has a built in bias.
A recent STA grad.
Also, a private school bias.
Also, lack of seeing games other than teams that played against STA, and now some games in the Duluth area.
He is also very young with virtually no hockey experience.

BUT, he does do research and he does a decent summary.
His logic (as viewed by some) may be biased and flawed, but the effort is what counts AND he gives us fodder to generate discussion.

Bottom line, he helps make all this fun, so keep it up Watcher.
(And to thet critics, keep it up, also.)


.

I agree with Elliott,

Keep up the good work HSHW