Try-outs open or closed.

[MNM JMH]

I have heard Edina and WBL both have open try-outs. If that is the case, I find myself ?ing why forest Lake has "closed" tryouts. I have to think that Edina and WBL know what they are doing. What does your assc. do for try-outs. Does your assc. have kids try-out by position @ bantams?

What % does the coach get to pick?

Just ask your "well known Edina buddy".

Foggedglassman

[edgeUcated]

I see no "logical" reason to have open tryouts -- Who is the only one that benefits in that scenario? Certainly not the kids -- even if it makes no difference to the kids. In closed tryout, I don't believe any kids is out there saying to themselves "boy I wish my parents were here to watch". In the case of A/B cut line, at least in the assoc I live in, the last three tryouts are open since they are scrimmages that have top 20-25. Then coaches pick from there. More of the emotion comes from B1/B2/C cut lines. I agree that is tough call and really a coaches pick as well from players 12-20. At the end of the day, open or closed will not change the results - Logic tells me closed is the best for the kids and open is best for the parents. Even if every parent is at their best behavior in the stands -- the lobby chatter will still be there with rose colored glasses on.

[NE14HKY]

I see no "logical" reason to have open tryouts -- Who is the only one that benefits in that scenario? Certainly not the kids -- even if it makes no difference to the kids. In closed tryout, I don't believe any kids is out there saying to themselves "boy I wish my parents were here to watch". In the case of A/B cut line, at least in the assoc I live in, the last three tryouts are open since they are scrimmages that have top 20-25. Then coaches pick from there. More of the emotion comes from B1/B2/C cut lines. I agree that is tough call and really a coaches pick as well from players 12-20. At the end of the day, open or closed will not change the results - Logic tells me closed is the best for the kids and open is best for the parents. Even if every parent is at their best behavior in the stands -- the lobby chatter will still be there with rose colored glasses on.

+1 on the rose colored glasses. Seems to rule
all!

Our association has closed tryouts and I like it
that way. To each his own, I guess.

[C-dad]

I have heard Edina and WBL both have open try-outs. If that is the case, I find myself ?ing why forest Lake has "closed" tryouts. I have to think that Edina and WBL know what they are doing. What does your assc. do for try-outs. Does your assc. have kids try-out by position @ bantams?

What % does the coach get to pick?

Just ask your "well known Edina buddy".

Foggedglassman

Edina has a "grading session" (actually four sessions) - all drills, to sort the kids into groups 1-5. The evaluators for these are coaches who don't have kids at the level or coach or that level (supposedly). Then a series of scrimmages within the groups. Evaluators led by the A (or now AA) coaches move kids up or down between groups. The top end kids then do some scrimmages with other associations. Then the coaches draft who they want, starting with AA coaches and any level with 2 or more teams doing alternating picks for hopefully balanced teams. Or so the board says it is supposed to happen. What goes on in the association room is anyone's guess. All sessions, except in the board room, are open.

[Deep Breath]

I got a kick out of the post that stated that parents don't select the drills or the players. Wow. Maybe need to do a check on just how many associations have parent coaches at the PWA(AA) level. There is no good reason to have any part of the tryout process closed. If a parent gets "unruly" during one of the skates, simply have her escorted out of the rink. Starting at the PW level, all scores that evaluators give players should be posted. Thsi whole notion of "protecting" the kids is a joke. Make the evaluators accountable for the grades/scores they give these kids. Assocaitions being cloaked in secrecy is pathetic. If things are being run on the "up n up" there is no reason to have any part of the process closed.

[MrBoDangles]

I have heard Edina and WBL both have open try-outs. If that is the case, I find myself ?ing why forest Lake has "closed" tryouts. I have to think that Edina and WBL know what they are doing. What does your assc. do for try-outs. Does your assc. have kids try-out by position @ bantams?

What % does the coach get to pick?

Just ask your "well known Edina buddy".

Foggedglassman

OldGoalie85 is moving to Edina?

[C-dad]

I got a kick out of the post that stated that parents don't select the drills or the players. Wow. Maybe need to do a check on just how many associations have parent coaches at the PWA(AA) level. There is no good reason to have any part of the tryout process closed. If a parent gets "unruly" during one of the skates, simply have her escorted out of the rink. Starting at the PW level, all scores that evaluators give players should be posted. Thsi whole notion of "protecting" the kids is a joke. Make the evaluators accountable for the grades/scores they give these kids. Assocaitions being cloaked in secrecy is pathetic. If things are being run on the "up n up" there is no reason to have any part of the process closed.

I agree.

[old goalie85]

Bo-I couldn't afford the Taxes on that side of town.

[old goalie85]

Certainly not a house. Seems 70-30 for open tryouts.

[Bluewhitefan]

What % does the coach get to pick?

Just ask your "well known Edina buddy".

Foggedglassman

Edina has a "grading session" (actually four sessions) - all drills, to sort the kids into groups 1-5. The evaluators for these are coaches who don't have kids at the level or coach or that level (supposedly). Then a series of scrimmages within the groups. Evaluators led by the A (or now AA) coaches move kids up or down between groups. The top end kids then do some scrimmages with other associations. Then the coaches draft who they want, starting with AA coaches and any level with 2 or more teams doing alternating picks for hopefully balanced teams. Or so the board says it is supposed to happen. What goes on in the association room is anyone's guess. All sessions, except in the board room, are open.

What exactly do you think is going on in the associtation room? I can't believe they do anything but a equitable draft at B1 and below. Word would definitely get out if there was something tawdry going on - none of these people could ever keep a secret.

[black sheep]

open or closed should not make a difference if:

after the tryout you have a clear understanding of your players placement so that you can help your player with their developmental needs (physical or mental).

if it is open - if you are watching as a parent you should have a genral understanding of where your player is at. remember all coaches look for different things, sometimes its as simple as listening and staying on task makes that difference.

if it is closed - the critera should absolutely be made public, or at a minimum a private evaluation sheet provided for each player so that you can help your player undertand development needs.

Parents are nuts at tryouts - there are alot who do indeed wear rose colored glasses. If you are clearly a top half player you will not get missed. If you are a bottom half player it doesn't really matter becasue there are values to playing up or down. Just never make excuses for your player!!!!

[stromboli]

I got a kick out of the post that stated that parents don't select the drills or the players. Wow. Maybe need to do a check on just how many associations have parent coaches at the PWA(AA) level. There is no good reason to have any part of the tryout process closed. If a parent gets "unruly" during one of the skates, simply have her escorted out of the rink. Starting at the PW level, all scores that evaluators give players should be posted. Thsi whole notion of "protecting" the kids is a joke. Make the evaluators accountable for the grades/scores they give these kids. Assocaitions being cloaked in secrecy is pathetic. If things are being run on the "up n up" there is no reason to have any part of the process closed.

Nope, don't need to do a check on how many coaches are also parents. The subject is closed or open tryouts. Pretty sure the focus of the discussion is on whether parents should be allowed to be in the arena -- not on whether the coaches should be. I'm assuming the coaches would be in the arena either way and would control the drills and final selections. Guess you read it differently.

Seeing scores posted doesn't change the results either. It's not much different of an issue than whether the tryouts are open or closed. Since parents (the non-coaches) don't know what the evaluators are seeing and basin their scores on -- the scores don't matter. Except to those with conspiracy theory issues.

[luckyEPDad]

Nope, don't need to do a check on how many coaches are also parents. The subject is closed or open tryouts. Pretty sure the focus of the discussion is on whether parents should be allowed to be in the arena -- not on whether the coaches should be. I'm assuming the coaches would be in the arena either way and would control the drills and final selections. Guess you read it differently.

If the evaluations are to have any meaning I don't think the coaches should play any role in tryouts. Parent or not. If coaches have a say, why are there evaluators? Is coach input given the same weight as the evaluators?

When I coached youth sports I had no say in what players where on the team. Why is hockey different?

[IHEA]

I got a kick out of the post that stated that parents don't select the drills or the players. Wow. Maybe need to do a check on just how many associations have parent coaches at the PWA(AA) level. There is no good reason to have any part of the tryout process closed. If a parent gets "unruly" during one of the skates, simply have her escorted out of the rink. Starting at the PW level, all scores that evaluators give players should be posted. Thsi whole notion of "protecting" the kids is a joke. Make the evaluators accountable for the grades/scores they give these kids. Assocaitions being cloaked in secrecy is pathetic. If things are being run on the "up n up" there is no reason to have any part of the process closed.

Nope, don't need to do a check on how many coaches are also parents. The subject is closed or open tryouts. Pretty sure the focus of the discussion is on whether parents should be allowed to be in the arena -- not on whether the coaches should be. I'm assuming the coaches would be in the arena either way and would control the drills and final selections. Guess you read it differently.

Seeing scores posted doesn't change the results either. It's not much different of an issue than whether the tryouts are open or closed. Since parents (the non-coaches) don't know what the evaluators are seeing and basin their scores on -- the scores don't matter. Except to those with conspiracy theory issues.

How is it that the topic is limited to parents? Must have missed the fineprint. It's true that the parents don't know exactly what the evaluators/coaches use but its also true that there is another level of accountability that the e/c have with other eyes watching. If they are 100% on the level then no problem. But geez, you never heard of unscrupulous coaches that do the damdest things?? You say conspiracy theory but can tell you that an A team coach I know said there are political picks (dad coach kid, friends kid, heavy weight parents' kid...) on most teams and he said on many teams its more than 1. It's tougher to make those picks if there are 5 or 6 clearly better skaters on the ice fighting for the last 1 or 2 spots and everyone bears witness to that. And if the e/c still make those picks, they will be accountable and that kind of selection may or may not catch up to them, depending on the association.

Yes there are factors that parents may not understand (committment, coachability, listening,,,) that may not be directly tied to the player's performance in a tryout. But there are other factors that SOME coaches use that are below the belt. No conspiracy theory - reality.

Full disclosure is always the best policy. Coaches that like to close the doors or put paper/curtains up for tryouts or practices are just uncomfortable in their own skin and are not fully confident with the way they run things. If there is nothing to hide and you've got confidence in your methods, then let it all hang out!

[InigoMontoya]

I say let the parents watch. Rose colored glasses are nothing compared to the rose colored imagination.

[C-dad]

What exactly do you think is going on in the associtation room? I can't believe they do anything but a equitable draft at B1 and below. Word would definitely get out if there was something tawdry going on - none of these people could ever keep a secret.

Um, note the in my post.

[Shinbone_News]

Only argument for closed tryouts: Some parents really do cause problems not so much by trying to influence the evaluations but by making stuff up and then spreading it to other gullible parents and causing unnecessary stress and conflict in the association. (It doesn't take more than one or two clever but paranoid parents to poison the well of one team, and then potentially a whole age level -- all based on delusions of a conspiracy.)

That said, I think associations can write policies and rules to deal with this -- a clear and honorable grievance system, a behavior code that must be signed, etc.

Transparency is probably the best policy, associations should have nothing to hide in tryouts, and parents should set aside their own agendas.

I wish our association posted evaluation scores. It could be of tremendous service to players who really want to improve their game. Individual attention to development is something we should be better at. Evaluators should share the wealth of their knowledge, not hide it between the lines of the final rosters. (I agree though that those who insist there is some conspiracy against their kids will see something amiss in the evaluations too... just like the birthers who can't accept a certified and notarized birth certificate. The conspiracy comes first, and no "proof" could ever disprove their POV.)

[Bluewhitefan]

What exactly do you think is going on in the associtation room? I can't believe they do anything but a equitable draft at B1 and below. Word would definitely get out if there was something tawdry going on - none of these people could ever keep a secret.

Um, note the in my post.

I have no idea what those little faces mean.

[C-dad]

What exactly do you think is going on in the associtation room? I can't believe they do anything but a equitable draft at B1 and below. Word would definitely get out if there was something tawdry going on - none of these people could ever keep a secret.

Um, note the in my post.

I have no idea what those little faces mean.