What if the state tournament was a 16 team format?

[hermantown2000]

If the MSHSL ever decides to go back to a single tournament format I would love to see a "Sweet 16" type of tournament. How does everyone think that this years matchups would look if a 16 team format was in place? Obivously I would assume that Lakeville North and Edina would be 1 and 2. How would seeds 3-16 look?

[blueblood]

Hermantown 2000:

RU related to GMHF?

[defense]

If the MSHSL ever decides to go back to a single tournament format I would love to see a "Sweet 16" type of tournament. How does everyone think that this years matchups would look if a 16 team format was in place? Obivously I would assume that Lakeville North and Edina would be 1 and 2. How would seeds 3-16 look?

It would be pretty cool

[thestickler07]

It would be pretty cool

[Just Checking]

Hermantown 2000:

RU related to GMHF?

[Mnhockeys]

If the MSHSL ever decides to go back to a single tournament format I would love to see a "Sweet 16" type of tournament. How does everyone think that this years matchups would look if a 16 team format was in place? Obivously I would assume that Lakeville North and Edina would be 1 and 2. How would seeds 3-16 look?

One thing for sure is that the A teams that made to state now, would not make it, so you will have very different teams placed at seed 9-16. If you think they have teams play a and aa sections, then combining the a and aa teams in state tournament, that would unlikely happen.

[hshockeyfan53]

If the MSHSL ever decides to go back to a single tournament format I would love to see a "Sweet 16" type of tournament. How does everyone think that this years matchups would look if a 16 team format was in place? Obivously I would assume that Lakeville North and Edina would be 1 and 2. How would seeds 3-16 look?

One thing for sure is that the A teams that made to state now, would not make it, so you will have very different teams placed at seed 9-16. If you think they have teams play a and aa sections, then combining the a and aa teams in state tournament, that would unlikely happen.

Simply not true. Hermantown, Mahtomedi and EGF all would probably be in the top 16. Hermantown would be in the top 4.

[Gov78]

If the MSHSL ever decides to go back to a single tournament format I would love to see a "Sweet 16" type of tournament. How does everyone think that this years matchups would look if a 16 team format was in place? Obivously I would assume that Lakeville North and Edina would be 1 and 2. How would seeds 3-16 look?

I'm 99% certain this won't happen as what's the value considering the logistics and costs?

This has been brought up more times than I can count since going to 2 classes/tiers and I suspect it will continue to be discussed but until the MSHSL changes it's position on regional representation along with the ongoing layering of competition to more not less classes this isn't going to happen.

MSHSL will *never* state their objective is to have have the *best* 8 or 16 teams in the state tournament and regardless there is no way to guarantee that would occur.

[fastncrash]

If the MSHSL ever decides to go back to a single tournament format I would love to see a "Sweet 16" type of tournament. How does everyone think that this years matchups would look if a 16 team format was in place? Obivously I would assume that Lakeville North and Edina would be 1 and 2. How would seeds 3-16 look?

What if the NHL and AHL combine their Season's Playoff's?

[ted2you]

In My Humble Opinion:


Hermantown would be seeded 4th.
Mahtomedi #5
EGF #8
Breck #11
SPL would be 16
New Ulm #15
New Prague#14
Apollo#13

I wish they would do this and if they were to utilize this format I would hope that the first round would pit A 1-8 and AA1-8 and then re-seed them.

I think EGF-Edina last season would have been a fantastic game!

[East Side Pioneer Guy]

If this bad idea were implemented, I would highly encourage HM, STA, and Roseau to compete in Class A. This would allow more of the better teams into the field so it wouldn't be so watered down.

Basket ball tried this. For two years. 'Nuff said.

[hawkhockey]

Also if this bad idea was implemented there would need to be an additional game added to the tournament. This would mean an additional day which is already extremely unlikely. There's already enough complaint about AA teams playing 3 games in 3 days. Would we really want to add a 4th in 4 days? I don't see stretching it out over two weekends to be feasible for money and time issues. The tournament is a beautiful institution as it stands right now. I don't understand the constant complaining that it needs to be altered in some way. For me, I'll be there for 3 and a half days watching a level of hockey I normally don't get to see and enjoying every single minute of it. I've been looking forward to Wednesday at 11 since running time of last year's final.

[Zamman]

Hermantown would continue to whine then....

[Mnhockeys]

If the MSHSL ever decides to go back to a single tournament format I would love to see a "Sweet 16" type of tournament. How does everyone think that this years matchups would look if a 16 team format was in place? Obivously I would assume that Lakeville North and Edina would be 1 and 2. How would seeds 3-16 look?

One thing for sure is that the A teams that made to state now, would not make it, so you will have very different teams placed at seed 9-16. If you think they have teams play a and aa sections, then combining the a and aa teams in state tournament, that would unlikely happen.

Simply not true. Hermantown, Mahtomedi and EGF all would probably be in the top 16. Hermantown would be in the top 4.

Should have played in the 2A schedule then, huh?

[hshockeyfan53]

One thing for sure is that the A teams that made to state now, would not make it, so you will have very different teams placed at seed 9-16. If you think they have teams play a and aa sections, then combining the a and aa teams in state tournament, that would unlikely happen.

Simply not true. Hermantown, Mahtomedi and EGF all would probably be in the top 16. Hermantown would be in the top 4.

Should have played in the 2A schedule then, huh?

What do you mean? All three of those schools played and beat quality AA schools throughout the season. To suggest that not one of them would be in the top 16 in AA just shows that you obviously don't know what much about any of the teams.

[hshockeyfan53]

Also if this bad idea was implemented there would need to be an additional game added to the tournament. This would mean an additional day which is already extremely unlikely. There's already enough complaint about AA teams playing 3 games in 3 days. Would we really want to add a 4th in 4 days? I don't see stretching it out over two weekends to be feasible for money and time issues. The tournament is a beautiful institution as it stands right now. I don't understand the constant complaining that it needs to be altered in some way. For me, I'll be there for 3 and a half days watching a level of hockey I normally don't get to see and enjoying every single minute of it. I've been looking forward to Wednesday at 11 since running time of last year's final.

No matter how the tournament is formatted there will always be people who want to modify it a certain way. With that being said, most of the calls for changes to the format come when you look at some of the teams being left out every year. We all know that we don't get the 8 best teams in AA and the 8 best teams in A in the tournament every year. Would that be ideal? Of course. However, there's really no foolproof and ethical way to assure everyone that the top 8 teams are the 8 that end up in St. Paul every March aside from having coaches and the media just select the top 8 which would start a big poop storm. Thoughts?

[hshockeyfan53]

Imagine a single A tourney like this:

#1 Hermantown
#2 Mahtomedi
#3 East Grand Forks
#4 Breck
#5 Duluth Marshall
#6 Thief River Falls
#7 Delano
#8 Alexandria

I just grabbed a couple teams for the last couple spots so don't tear me apart but I'm just trying to show how awesome it would be if we actually got the best 8 teams to St. Paul every year. Unlikely to ever happen but it's kind of fun to think about!

[hawkhockey]

Also if this bad idea was implemented there would need to be an additional game added to the tournament. This would mean an additional day which is already extremely unlikely. There's already enough complaint about AA teams playing 3 games in 3 days. Would we really want to add a 4th in 4 days? I don't see stretching it out over two weekends to be feasible for money and time issues. The tournament is a beautiful institution as it stands right now. I don't understand the constant complaining that it needs to be altered in some way. For me, I'll be there for 3 and a half days watching a level of hockey I normally don't get to see and enjoying every single minute of it. I've been looking forward to Wednesday at 11 since running time of last year's final.

No matter how the tournament is formatted there will always be people who want to modify it a certain way. With that being said, most of the calls for changes to the format come when you look at some of the teams being left out every year. We all know that we don't get the 8 best teams in AA and the 8 best teams in A in the tournament every year. Would that be ideal? Of course. However, there's really no foolproof and ethical way to assure everyone that the top 8 teams are the 8 that end up in St. Paul every March aside from having coaches and the media just select the top 8 which would start a big poop storm. Thoughts?

The problem with the argument that there are always good teams left out of the tournament is that MSHSL is very clear that the goal of the state tournament is not to assemble the 8 best teams in the state, but the single best team from each region. I don't mean to be dismissive but if there are so many people that disagree with how the field is assembled, they should attempt to wrestle control of the tournament and high school hockey away from the state high school league. I adamantly believe the tournament is perfect how it is. Every single team has the opportunity to play in St. Paul if they can string 3 (sometimes 4) wins together at the right time.

[Mnhockeys]

Simply not true. Hermantown, Mahtomedi and EGF all would probably be in the top 16. Hermantown would be in the top 4.

Should have played in the 2A schedule then, huh?

What do you mean? All three of those schools played and beat quality AA schools throughout the season. To suggest that not one of them would be in the top 16 in AA just shows that you obviously don't know what much about any of the teams.

I meant to play in the AA sections then. Here is a question for those knowing all the teams ... how do the A section top finishers match up with the 2nd places from all 8 AA sections?

Stillwater, Farmington, Eastview, Centennial, Elk River, Minnetonka, Burnsville, Moorhead

vs.

Hermantown, Mahtomedi, East Grand Forks, Breck, Duluth Marshall, Thief River Falls, Delano, Alexandria

[warriors41]

Should have played in the 2A schedule then, huh?

What do you mean? All three of those schools played and beat quality AA schools throughout the season. To suggest that not one of them would be in the top 16 in AA just shows that you obviously don't know what much about any of the teams.

I meant to play in the AA sections then. Here is a question for those knowing all the teams ... how do the A section top finishers match up with the 2nd places from all 8 AA sections?

Stillwater, Farmington, Eastview, Centennial, Elk River, Minnetonka, Burnsville, Moorhead

vs.

Hermantown, Mahtomedi, East Grand Forks, Breck, Duluth Marshall, Thief River Falls, Delano, Alexandria

EGF would probably represent section 8 the last two years.

[hshockeyfan53]

Also if this bad idea was implemented there would need to be an additional game added to the tournament. This would mean an additional day which is already extremely unlikely. There's already enough complaint about AA teams playing 3 games in 3 days. Would we really want to add a 4th in 4 days? I don't see stretching it out over two weekends to be feasible for money and time issues. The tournament is a beautiful institution as it stands right now. I don't understand the constant complaining that it needs to be altered in some way. For me, I'll be there for 3 and a half days watching a level of hockey I normally don't get to see and enjoying every single minute of it. I've been looking forward to Wednesday at 11 since running time of last year's final.

No matter how the tournament is formatted there will always be people who want to modify it a certain way. With that being said, most of the calls for changes to the format come when you look at some of the teams being left out every year. We all know that we don't get the 8 best teams in AA and the 8 best teams in A in the tournament every year. Would that be ideal? Of course. However, there's really no foolproof and ethical way to assure everyone that the top 8 teams are the 8 that end up in St. Paul every March aside from having coaches and the media just select the top 8 which would start a big poop storm. Thoughts?

The problem with the argument that there are always good teams left out of the tournament is that MSHSL is very clear that the goal of the state tournament is not to assemble the 8 best teams in the state, but the single best team from each region. I don't mean to be dismissive but if there are so many people that disagree with how the field is assembled, they should attempt to wrestle control of the tournament and high school hockey away from the state high school league. I adamantly believe the tournament is perfect how it is. Every single team has the opportunity to play in St. Paul if they can string 3 (sometimes 4) wins together at the right time.

Right on I agree 100% I was just pointing out what the argument against the current format is. Not that my personal opinion matters, but I enjoy the current format. Gives lesser known teams/regions a taste of the tourney which is awesome! We are so spoiled in this state to have such a great event every year where the entire state is captivated. There's few things I enjoy more throughout the year than the state hockey tournament.

[rainier]

While the 16 team tourney is an interesting thought experiment, the A and AA tourneys have proven to be a great system. Not perfect by any stretch, but still a lot of fun for many schools.

I know many people have pined for a return to the original 8 team tourney, but what we have now is very close to that. If top A teams were more flexible about opting up, then it would in effect be the same.

What I mean is it would be neat if teams like EGF, Hermantown, Mahtomedi, Breck, Warroad, Lourdes, Hibbing, Little Falls, etc. would opt up to AA when they see they have a group coming through that would have a solid chance at making it to state in AA.

Opting up to AA is not like opting to have your leg amputated; it can be reversed. It seems like there is this idea that once you go AA you can never go back, and I think that keeps some great A teams from taking the chance at AA for a couple years.

If A teams opted up more often when they had great teams, then the AA tourney would be VERY close to the single class tourney of yesteryear.

[hammer99]

Why not just have the A and AA winners play each other?

Seems simple enough, but it seems like the concept is never really taken seriously by anyone. The tourney ends on Saturday, so why not play it on Sunday night?

The ratings for this game would be off the chart every year, and the stories of upsets would be retold for years to come.

[east hockey]

Why not just have the A and AA winners play each other?

Seems simple enough, but it seems like the concept is never really taken seriously by anyone. The tourney ends on Saturday, so why not play it on Sunday night?

The ratings for this game would be off the chart every year, and the stories of upsets would be retold for years to come.

They used to do this in basketball. And I just threw up in my mouth making the comparison.

Lee

[Just Checking]

While the 16 team tourney is an interesting thought experiment, the A and AA tourneys have proven to be a great system. Not perfect by any stretch, but still a lot of fun for many schools.

I know many people have pined for a return to the original 8 team tourney, but what we have now is very close to that. If top A teams were more flexible about opting up, then it would in effect be the same.

What I mean is it would be neat if teams like EGF, Hermantown, Mahtomedi, Breck, Warroad, Lourdes, Hibbing, Little Falls, etc. would opt up to AA when they see they have a group coming through that would have a solid chance at making it to state in AA.

Opting up to AA is not like opting to have your leg amputated; it can be reversed. It seems like there is this idea that once you go AA you can never go back, and I think that keeps some great A teams from taking the chance at AA for a couple years.

If A teams opted up more often when they had great teams, then the AA tourney would be VERY close to the single class tourney of yesteryear.

Agree. I still like the option of the A champ moving up the next year and they stay as long as they are section champs. They can go right back to A as soon as they miss. But I also agree they should be able to opt up and down with more ease, less commitment time.