Stang5280 wrote:I tend to think that youth program depth is overrated, at least once you get to the Bantam level. So few players below the top Bantam team will ever see varsity ice time, much less contribute on any meaningful level. Heck, in a well balanced system some of the players from the top Bantam team will be squeezed out of varsity. The cornerstone of maintaining a strong program is churning out a handful of solid varsity caliber players in each class, and adding a few stars to the mix.
Yes, depth is helpful at the lower levels in terms of driving up participation and encouraging kids to keep playing and develop their skills. However, the fact that most strong HS programs also have deep youth systems may be more of a correlation than causation (i.e. kids are excited about participating in a winning system, even if their chances of reaching the top of that pyramid aren’t great).
Geez, where did you go to high school STA or Blake?
C'mon, it gives some people a reason to buy a Thesaurus
SCBlueLiner wrote:When looking at the future prospects of a HS program I immediately go to the youth website and see how many teams they are fielding and what the records are like. First thing I look for is a pyramid, 6 Squirt teams, 5 Pee Wee teams, 4 Bantam teams, as opposed to an inverted pyramid where you have more Pee Wee teams than Squirt teams. The next thing I look at is depth, not just how the top team is doing but also the second team.
So I look at how Hermantown's Bantam A team has performed over the last several years and the results are not pretty. I actually had the occasion to see the Bantam A team a couple of times last season and they looked overmatched for A level hockey, probably would have been better served at B1. The Bantam AA team does very well, but how much of that success is the result of having transfer players (who more often than not tend to be stars) versus homegrown talent leading the way. What if the transfers completely dried up and the top Hermantown team was a combination of some of the current AA players and the better A players?
IMO, Hermantown lacks the depth that the large AA programs have. You don't see a massive drop off in results from AA to A to B1, etc. at the top programs in the state. It speaks to the depth that they have, depth that is needed when players peak early and plateau as sophomores instead of as seniors, top players depart early for juniors, etc.
This analysis does not look at specific players or specific classes, just a general overall picture of the program, its depth and results, not just results of the top teams but the results of the second and third teams in a division. I think a move to AA would slowly erode the program and you would begin to see depth issues. There would be HS teams that would contend, but there would also be peaks and valleys like most other programs experience as special classes come through the system. In other words, Hermantown would eventually become just another AA program.
I tend to think that youth program depth is overrated, at least once you get to the Bantam level. So few players below the top Bantam team will ever see varsity ice time, much less contribute on any meaningful level. Heck, in a well balanced system some of the players from the top Bantam team will be squeezed out of varsity. The cornerstone of maintaining a strong program is churning out a handful of solid varsity caliber players in each class, and adding a few stars to the mix.
Yes, depth is helpful at the lower levels in terms of driving up participation and encouraging kids to keep playing and develop their skills. However, the fact that most strong HS programs also have deep youth systems may be more of a correlation than causation (i.e. kids are excited about participating in a winning system, even if their chances of reaching the top of that pyramid aren’t great).
I suppose it depends on the program, but I'm not sure i can agree on this. I grew up in a large AA program and know at least half of the B1 Bantam team (when that was the second best team at the youth level) from my last bantam year played regular varsity minutes on a state tournament team. One player from that team (played A bantams the next year) has played in the NHL this season. Again, depends on the program, but even after bantams kids can bloom and leapfrog other players.
I was at the Saint Thomas arena today and looked up at all the class A banners in the rafters. I said to my self what a joke! How bout you win a title or two and then move on. Now we have Hermantown doing same thing and the Wolfman don’t like it. I kind of like a team to hate more then any other so stay in 7A Hermantown. Someday you will get beat by a small town class A team in a meaningful game and I will smile.
wolfman wrote:I was at the Saint Thomas arena today and looked up at all the class A banners in the rafters. I said to my self what a joke! How bout you win a title or two and then move on. Now we have Hermantown doing same thing and the Wolfman don’t like it. I kind of like a team to hate more then any other so stay in 7A Hermantown. Someday you will get beat by a small town class A team in a meaningful game and I will smile.
St. Thomas have a nice arena? Is it their arena only or do they share it with another HS program. ?
You would think Hermantown hockey would have a wonderful new, nice, state of the art rink to showcase all that talent and banners. It’s confusing they play in a dumpster fire like the arena they’ve got presently. The money, banners, talent, and former NHLers are everywhere in that community. I do not like high school hockey games there at all. Cramped as all get out, and filming hockey games there? New Proctor rink. Now there is a community proud of their hockey.
A person is successful in their career. The buy and live in a trailer in a nice community. They have people over for dinner parties and hang their paychecks, degrees, and accomplishments from the kitchen ceiling.
wolfman wrote:I was at the Saint Thomas arena today and looked up at all the class A banners in the rafters. I said to my self what a joke! How bout you win a title or two and then move on. Now we have Hermantown doing same thing and the Wolfman don’t like it. I kind of like a team to hate more then any other so stay in 7A Hermantown. Someday you will get beat by a small town class A team in a meaningful game and I will smile.
St. Thomas have a nice arena? Is it their arena only or do they share it with another HS program. ?
You would think Hermantown hockey would have a wonderful new, nice, state of the art rink to showcase all that talent and banners. It’s confusing they play in a dumpster fire like the arena they’ve got presently. The money, banners, talent, and former NHLers are everywhere in that community. I do not like high school hockey games there at all. Cramped as all get out, and filming hockey games there? New Proctor rink. Now there is a community proud of their hockey.
The old Nymore rink in Bemidji was hockey palace compared to H'town rink.
wolfman wrote:I was at the Saint Thomas arena today and looked up at all the class A banners in the rafters. I said to my self what a joke! How bout you win a title or two and then move on. Now we have Hermantown doing same thing and the Wolfman don’t like it. I kind of like a team to hate more then any other so stay in 7A Hermantown. Someday you will get beat by a small town class A team in a meaningful game and I will smile.
St. Thomas have a nice arena? Is it their arena only or do they share it with another HS program. ?
You would think Hermantown hockey would have a wonderful new, nice, state of the art rink to showcase all that talent and banners. It’s confusing they play in a dumpster fire like the arena they’ve got presently. The money, banners, talent, and former NHLers are everywhere in that community. I do not like high school hockey games there at all. Cramped as all get out, and filming hockey games there? New Proctor rink. Now there is a community proud of their hockey.
The old Nymore rink in Bemidji was hockey palace compared to H'town rink.
That is a bit of a stretch.
Nymore Gardens may be on the way out.
Plans for a Bemidji community center on NW side of town by the hospital with two rink system. Construction is in 2019.
Last edited by elliott70 on Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
kniven wrote:That is awesome! Hermantown hockey deserves a nice place to call home
I believe they were referring to Bemidji. Hermantown doesn't have a hospital, which is weird, given how many doctors live there. I wonder where they all work?
wolfman wrote:I was at the Saint Thomas arena today and looked up at all the class A banners in the rafters. I said to my self what a joke! How bout you win a title or two and then move on. Now we have Hermantown doing same thing and the Wolfman don’t like it. I kind of like a team to hate more then any other so stay in 7A Hermantown. Someday you will get beat by a small town class A team in a meaningful game and I will smile.
St. Thomas have a nice arena? Is it their arena only or do they share it with another HS program. ?
You would think Hermantown hockey would have a wonderful new, nice, state of the art rink to showcase all that talent and banners. It’s confusing they play in a dumpster fire like the arena they’ve got presently. The money, banners, talent, and former NHLers are everywhere in that community. I do not like high school hockey games there at all. Cramped as all get out, and filming hockey games there? New Proctor rink. Now there is a community proud of their hockey.
The old Nymore rink in Bemidji was hockey palace compared to H'town rink.
Desperate need for another sheet of inside ice at HT. Name me top a 20 public AA program that only has 1 sheet of ice. That 1 sheet of ice has to take care of Varsity boys and girls, JV and the entire youth program. Hermantown kids are travelling around the entire area at all hours for ice. The problem is compounded if the outside rinks are not ready and the weather is not cooperating. Even Cloquet has the "Barn".To me this is essential if they are to have any consistent success at AA.
Wow! Just browsed through this new thread for the first time.
As I’ve said many times, Hermantown alone has more drama than the entire west metro! No wait- I will throw in the south metro and the northwest metro! No wait – I will throw in Saint Thomas as well!
wolfman wrote:I was at the Saint Thomas arena today and looked up at all the class A banners in the rafters. I said to my self what a joke! How bout you win a title or two and then move on. Now we have Hermantown doing same thing and the Wolfman don’t like it. I kind of like a team to hate more then any other so stay in 7A Hermantown. Someday you will get beat by a small town class A team in a meaningful game and I will smile.
St. Thomas have a nice arena? Is it their arena only or do they share it with another HS program. ?
STA has a beautiful arena right across the street from campus. Ironically, they share it with the University of St. Thomas teams, who have to travel down to Mendota Heights for practices and games.
kniven wrote:You would think Hermantown hockey would have a wonderful new, nice, state of the art rink to showcase all that talent and banners. It’s confusing they play in a dumpster fire like the arena they’ve got presently. The money, banners, talent, and former NHLers are everywhere in that community. I do not like high school hockey games there at all. Cramped as all get out, and filming hockey games there? New Proctor rink. Now there is a community proud of their hockey.
I’m surprised to hear that Hermantown hasn’t upgraded their facilities. I used to referee youth games in the area years ago when my sister lived in Duluth, and Hermantown was one of my least favorite arenas (though Fryberger easily was the worst).
kniven wrote:A person is successful in their career. The buy and live in a trailer in a nice community. They have people over for dinner parties and hang their paychecks, degrees, and accomplishments from the kitchen ceiling.
Dude, did you forget to take your medication again today?
kniven wrote:A person is successful in their career. The buy and live in a trailer in a nice community. They have people over for dinner parties and hang their paychecks, degrees, and accomplishments from the kitchen ceiling.
Dude, did you forget to take your medication again today?
Did Jeffy95 finally get the boot? Slow day at the office so I was looking through here expecting to see some of his hot takes and I don't see anything.
GoldyGopher wrote:Did Jeffy95 finally get the boot? Slow day at the office so I was looking through here expecting to see some of his hot takes and I don't see anything.
kniven wrote:That is awesome! Hermantown hockey deserves a nice place to call home
Hermantown is working on it.
But it is a tough project for such a small town without a lot of resources.
Didn't they just build a new school there? I suspect (but don't know) that getting another tax increase to build a new facility there will be a tough sell for them.
kniven wrote:That is awesome! Hermantown hockey deserves a nice place to call home
Hermantown is working on it.
But it is a tough project for such a small town without a lot of resources.
Didn't they just build a new school there? I suspect (but don't know) that getting another tax increase to build a new facility there will be a tough sell for them.
Jack those taxes up. Those latte drinking liberals love paying higher taxes
kniven wrote:That is awesome! Hermantown hockey deserves a nice place to call home
Hermantown is working on it.
But it is a tough project for such a small town without a lot of resources.
Didn't they just build a new school there? I suspect (but don't know) that getting another tax increase to build a new facility there will be a tough sell for them.
Yes. Money for Arena will have to come from somewhere else. Send your donations to HAHA.
elliott70 wrote:
Hermantown is working on it.
But it is a tough project for such a small town without a lot of resources.
Didn't they just build a new school there? I suspect (but don't know) that getting another tax increase to build a new facility there will be a tough sell for them.
Yes. Money for Arena will have to come from somewhere else. Send your donations to HAHA.
I would imagine it is a hard sell to build a new arena after all the school infrastructure and facilities investments over the last couple of years. There is a limited tax base in Hermantown. Some might be able to afford more, but there needs to be a level of responsibility. Not everyone living in Hermantown has a kid in hockey, and not everyone is a Duluth doctor living up over the hill.
Watched Hermantown and Proctor last night end at 10-1 and shots were 59-6. Proctor actually scored 1st on breakaway. Was tough to watch as as these section games should be a little closer.
Last edited by Duluth_Topper on Tue Jan 30, 2018 1:47 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Duluth_Topper wrote:Watched Hermantown destroy Proctor last night 10-1 and out shot them 59-6. Proctor actually scored 1st on breakaway with H-Towns backup goalie. They also didn't even start the top line. Had 3 shorthanded goals. Should have been 20-0.
