Comments for MN HOckey Board

[elliott70]

What would you like to tell the MN Hockey Board?

What is it we need to know about your hockey player, family, association?

What is it MN Hockey could do better or different to make it better for you?

[Hockeyguy_27]

What would you like to tell the MN Hockey Board?

What is it we need to know about your hockey player, family, association?

What is it MN Hockey could do better or different to make it better for you?

I have 3 things as a coach I would like to see addressed:

1. As coaches we are grown men and don't need to be told to wear helmets. If we get a puck in the face or worse, we take full responsibility.

2. Too many referees are hiding behind the zero tolerance policy to avoid any accountability regarding rule interpretation or even questioning a call. Ever since this policy came into effect, it has been a proverbial carte blache for some officials to throw a coach out of a game just because they can.

3. Hep points. They are weighted too heavily and because they are subjectively enforced, they should only be used in tie-breaking situation.

[O-townClown]

1. As coaches we are grown men and don't need to be told to wear helmets. If we get a puck in the face or worse, we take full responsibility.

A coach standing idly gets brushed by a kid from behind, falls, and bonks his noggin. Falls into a vegetative state never to be a fully functioning human again. While he may "take full responsibility" the family sues the rink, the association, Minnesota Hockey, and USA Hockey.

It never happened to any of my youth coaches, but that scenario causes those in charge to put safeguards in place so it doesn't happen.

Baseball will now require helmets because of the Coolbaugh accident.

[spin-o-rama]

Re: helmets for coaches.

If you played hockey then you have one (or more) and are used to wearing it. It's no big deal.

If you didn't play hockey then you should get one and wear it. It's common sense.

Sorry to further derail the thread.

[boblee]

Elliott, my thoughts:

-No helmets needed.

-No fair play points.

-16 minute periods.

-Coaches addressing officials. I have seen too many refs say this "coaches shouldn't be talking to the refs." I am so sick of hearing that. A ref should be able to have a conversation with a coach, no problem.

[Love goood hockey]

First the period length can be changed at the district level. District 16 went to 17 minute periods a few years back, District 10 has been doing it for a couple years now, District 11 just went to it this year. As far as region and state tournaments, yeah that would be cool if it was brought up. But if you are looking for a solution closer to home, you need to get it brought up at your district meeting.

Helmets, I don't think MH can do anything about that anymore, that is has been adopted by USA hockey, think their hands are tied there. Would be interesting though on a side note, to find out why the coaches in Ann Arbour aren't required to wear them? You'd think whats good for the goose...

I think it would be great if you could bring the definition of a tournament up and maybe begin the discussion to have it defined in a little different way. Here is why. Currently, if you are to play two teams from outside your district in the same weekend it should be considered a tournament and require sanctioning fee's, EMT's, etc. The program I am involved with has a hard time getting a whole lot of good competition rolling through. If we can talk a Metro team to come up and get them a chance to play another team from up north it sorta helps everyone involved. Like for instance, how many times does Roseau get to play Edina? I can't imagine to often. So if there is a chance they can meet half way, like Duluth or Grand Rapids, that is something that could go to raising the level of competition for northern teams. In the metro it isn't a big deal because most any of the suburbs are a realistic car ride apart. Up north we don't have that advantage. If the teams aren't playing off for a championship of some sort it really should just be ok to play "scrimage games" no matter where the teams are from.

I don't feel I articulated that very well, but I hope you get the jist.

I am also interested in anything concerning Tier I in Minnesota, I personally like the idea of having maybe a north and a south team, or through quadrants. But I'd like to see Minnesota Hockey take some active steps towards getting some sort of program running.

Thanks Mark, you do a great service to the members of Minnesota Hockey. It is impressive that you are willing to listen to others opinions and give them a chance to voice their case and whether you agree or not, you provide the forum. So again, Thank you.

[Pucknutz69]

What would you like to tell the MN Hockey Board?

What is it we need to know about your hockey player, family, association?

What is it MN Hockey could do better or different to make it better for you?

I have 3 things as a coach I would like to see addressed:

1. As coaches we are grown men and don't need to be told to wear helmets. If we get a puck in the face or worse, we take full responsibility.

2. Too many referees are hiding behind the zero tolerance policy to avoid any accountability regarding rule interpretation or even questioning a call. Ever since this policy came into effect, it has been a proverbial carte blache for some officials to throw a coach out of a game just because they can.

3. Hep points. They are weighted too heavily and because they are subjectively enforced, they should only be used in tie-breaking situation.

1 - Agree totally with the above statement. Go to watch a hockey game not a Reffing clinic.

2 - Straighten out the D8/D4 situation. Move some to D2, like Cottage Grove and Woodbury. Each District should have the same number of teams or close.

3 - Set team limits based on numbers, STATE WIDE not just by Districts. 2-A teams vs 1-A and 3-B. The State and Regional touranments are starting to be for large associations only, level the playing field for all to enjoy.


Thanks for your time and desire to make MN Hockey even better. Your willingness to take feedback is second to none. Thanks Elliot.

[StoppatchFairplayHelmets0]

What would you like to tell the MN Hockey Board?

What is it we need to know about your hockey player, family, association?

What is it MN Hockey could do better or different to make it better for you?

GET RID OF THE STOP PATCH...inefective unless it is as big as number.

GET RID OF FAIR PLAY POINTS...waters down the sport and there is no way you can carry it into playoffs so why have it at all. Correct me if I'm wrong but I'll bet the fair play system was developed to crack down on the check from behind? You could make that infraction a major penalty with intent resulting in a game suspension. Don't penalize a team for one kids actions.

MAKE HELMETS OPTIONAL...never happen but I'm asking

GET RID OF BLUE PUCK...dump them all in Lake Superior, or do they float as much as they bounce.

MANDATE 15 MIN PERIODS FOR ALL BANTAM LEVELS (AND PEEWEE "A") IN ALL DISTRICTS.
(IN DISTRICT 2 UNLESS YOU MAKE "A" TEAM YOU PLAY 11 MIN PERIODS...that's a 33 min game...what a joke)
If we are playing half hour games and have 4 practices in a week then our practice to game ratio is is 8-1. Wow, what a model for development.


All of the above would make it better for parents and the kids.

[jancze5]

1- Get rid of stop patch- useless as you can't see it nonetheless kids don't abide by it. The coach can teach the kids and 99% of hits from behind are inadvertant at the youth age levels

2- get rid of the maximum games rule at the younger age groups. It forces teams to have "scrimmages" and find ways to bend around the rules. If a Squirt team wants to play 70 games, let them. My only recommendation on the flip is the mandate a certain amount a practice hours a team MUST have during the season or in a month. Control the practice hours, not the game hour.

3- KEEP THE HELMET RULE- If you know Jordan Fleming, now 14 years old, whose father died in the hospital an hour after hitting his head on the ice in a practice at World Arena ice center in Colorado Springs, you'd know why this rule was adopted. It was Jordy's dad's death, on the doorstep of USA Hockey, that was a major influence in this decision. Keep the rule for safety sake. If you think your invincible as a coach, you're a fool.

4- 2 A teams for clubs that can afford it I'm not really sure how many can, we all know from the multitude of talks that Edina is one for sure, allow a program to petition at the time of tryouts, if they feel they have the depth to put 2 competetive A teams on the ice, to have it. There will in reality be a very few that can, but for those limited programs, having an exception that is best for the players and the organization as a whole.

5- build another rink in Woodbury please, dang it we need some ice, the State Fair coliseum is nice but it still smells like horse crap from the summer

Thanks Mark for your efforts for the kids of Minnesota...great recommendations everyone...

[tomASS]

I think that the state needs a new Hockey VP and I know just the right person.

[edge]

keep Association hockey and just go with the USA hockey age brackets (birth year).

[who_b_dat]

The top two things that any MN Hockey official can do for the youth of this state is to:

1) remember that local MN assoc's have been churning out quality hockey players long before you came to office. Please don't justify your existance by putting more layers of control and mandates upon these local assoc's. Stop patches, coaching certs, Hep points, blue pucks, are all examples of what I am talking about. How did we ever exist before ~97-99?? There appeared to be a host of new regulations created once a full time, paid executive position was created.

2) Always strive to ensure that any USA Hockey regulation/mandate makes sense for MN. Stick up for the MN kids where needed. I've witnessed the parent organization (USA Hockey) search for ways to standardize protocols/procedures to all participants irrespective of whether the change is needed or desired at the regional level. MN has a strong tradition of how we do things. What makes sense for emerging hockey communities like Cal, Fla, and the South, may not be apprpriate for MN. A good rep of MN Hockey would have the courage to stand up just like what was done on age groupings.

Just my $0.02

[who_b_dat]

and just go with the USA hockey age brackets (birth year).

I always was in favor of kids who go to class together also playing hockey together. Therfore, I, for one, disagree.

[cclavin]

MH needs to determine the future of private schools fielding bantam teams, these decisions should not be made at the district level.

[goalie30]

I have two kids in hockey, a 2nd year bantam and a first year mite.

The issue I'd like to see addressed is redistricting. Last year, our Bantam B1 team was undefeated in district play and won most games by more than four goals. The district we are in requires significant travel time. This year we decided to field two Bantam B1 teams in order to spread out the talent, develop more kids, and make the games more competitive. Our two teams are 24-0-2 in the districts. I'd rather win fewer games but have the games be more competitive. Playing in this district does not prepare our teams for some of the more difficult tournaments or for regions (if we get there). From an outsider’s point of view, districts 2, 3, 6, and 10 appear to be highly competitive from top to bottom (ok, from top to middle).

I'd like to see districts formed of teams that contain associations of equal size (objective standard) and skill (more subjective standard).

[GR3343]

Keep the helmet rule - by now, all are used to it. Heard a coach the other day say it feels weird not to have on while on the ice.

Agreed with Bob Lee about 16 min periods.

Bring back tag up off sides - at least at the bantam level. Nothing slows down a game more than automatic offsides.

[my2cents]

1) Implement delayed offsides for the Bantam level.

Better preperation for the HS level. The kids are already using it in off season games. Having a few less whistles per game would be nice too.

2) HEP points: I'm not against the HEP system except that the checking from behind applies 2+10 minutes which is too penalizing. Maybe it can be lowered a bit toward HEP. One ref calls CFB, another sees the same play and calls boarding or crosschecking. Too much interpretation determining the HEP point outcome. Also, 14 minute cap for Bantams playing 17 minute periods is not relative to the 12 minute cap for PW's playing 12 minute periods. I hate games where teams stop checking in the last period to save their HEP point. THAT IS NOT HOCKEY.

3) So far, the new system for rotating districts for regional tournament appears to be a workng OK, but I would like to see the State Tournies to continue to be represented by all geographic areas. The 5th best metro team doesn't have to be in the state tourney if they are better than some of the outstate teams in the tourney. They are still only the 5th best.

4) Continue to allow each district to independently manage most issues like scheduling, game lengths, coop teams, etc.

5) NO BLUE PUCKS. It is the most assinine idea ever to be implemented in hockey.

6) Avoid AAA age levels. Going to year class teams would hurt smaller associations that can't field deep teams when restricted to one year class. Stick with the July 1 cutoff. It more closely relates to keeping kids of the same grade together (no cutoff date is perfect).

7) SUPPORT ASSOCIATION HOCKEY. If it doesn't work best for you, then you should work with your association to make it better.

[Bronc]

What would you like to tell the MN Hockey Board?

What is it we need to know about your hockey player, family, association?

What is it MN Hockey could do better or different to make it better for you?

Great questions:

- All Bantam & Higher level PW games should be 1 1/2 hours long. In longer games..

- I believe recent policy changes have been geared to the less intense hockey family and player and agree with ensuring they have a place for all to play. However the players and families striving for a higher level of play, etc are being forced to AAA with game restrictions, length of games, etc.

Let's recognize we have very disctinct different groups to service and try to meet both needs and associations can price them accordingly.

- Continue to develop and work with referees so the top refs are working top age group and level games. Not just signing up on a first come first serve basis. They should be graded and then allowed to sign up for games at a level they are trained for and graded accordingly.

[elliott70]

Great!
Keep it coming.
Thanks, Mark

[watchdog]

everyone is doing a great job keep up the good work.

[Charliedog]

I'd like to see the number of A bantam refs dropped from 3 down to 2. Then I'd like to see each association use the money saved to do something for a disadvantaged hockey program. This would be a great character builder for the kids and send a positive message about Minnesota youth hockey to other states.

JV only uses 2 refs and they survive just fine.

[elliott70]

I am going to print these tomorrow at noon and then start a fresh thread.

I will mail these off tomorrow to Mn Hockey ex director and steering committee of the discernment committee.

Thanks for the great and speedy replies.
Keep adding them.

[O-townClown]

I think it is easy to see that the role of the Minnesota Hockey boardmember isn't easy. A lot of good ideas floating around but some are far from consensus.

Questions:

1) At what age are blue pucks used in Minnesota? I like seeing them for kids up to age 6. Are they being used for older kids? I'm surprised to see a few mentions suggesting getting rid of blue pucks. When I played we didn't start organized hockey until age 7.

2) A few people offer ideas that are opposed to USA Hockey guidelines. Helmets for coaches and a cap on games are two things they suggest that Minnesota has adopted. Do you feel that it is important to show USA Hockey that Minnesota is considerate of their initiatives in order to retain almost-total control of the community-based hockey model? I'd be leery of moving away from USA Hockey directives in certain places and run the risk of them no longer being supportive.

3) Why does Minnesota Hockey use July 1 instead of the school cut-off, which I believe is September 1? Is it because kids often are held back at kindergarten if they just miss the date, opting to be the oldest in their class versus the youngest?

[RLStars]

Use the two officials system for Bantam A OR go with two referees and one linesmen instead of the current one referee and two linesmen. You're asking that one referee to watch alot of fast action on and away from the puck while having two officials on the ice with very limited authority to make any calls. I personally like the latter option.

[countryboy]

Either standardize a propgram or allow transfers to programs that offer the appropriate program. Every Assoc carry a Squirt A, Peewee A, Bantam A and then adjust B teams and multiple A teams by a set program number. There is no need to have a association play god and eliminate a HOCKEY experience from any player. The waiver process needs to be reviewed if your program doesnt offer they shouldnt be able to stop you from going to one that does.