12U Players to Watch?

[eaaafan]

Who in your opinion are the best 12U players in the state please list by team name and player number?[/b]

[inthenet]

# 17 from Apple Valley, she plays with the boys Peewee A team and she plays Defense.
She will play as physical as any of the boys. (Alexis Joyce)

[eaaafan]

#27 North Wright County - Very steady defensive player - Great Skater can move the puck up the rink very well.

[shooter803]

#7 from Cloquet PeeWee A's - solid defense and plays on a top 12 team in the state.

[Pens4]

The question was the best 12U players...I'm sure all the girls playing PWA hockey are wonderful steady defensemen that move the puck well.

[royals dad]

I think it is fine to say U12 eligible on the girls side, I know there are some good ones playing JV and U14 as well. If the post is about the best U12s in the state, the players on the boys or JV teams might be ones alot of youth girls coaches and players have not seen.

Armstrong PWA has a really good girl plays some wing and defense. Fast and good vision, she will be an inpact player in the future.

I think the 7th grader on Hill Murray JV is U12 eligible, she has great speed and hands.

[jollyroger]

The question was the best 12U players...I'm sure all the girls playing PWA hockey are wonderful steady defensemen that move the puck well.

Pens, you da man!
Since opinions are like anuses (everyone has one and they're free) I'm going to give mine and you can rip me for it, that's fine.
I witnessed this scenario 3 times in the last 2 summers:
Girl plays PWA. She's a bigger kid--bigger than most boys since the boys grow later. Plays defense, (steady defensive defenseman). Then the girl plays U12AAA in the summer. The girl doesn't have great speed so gets burned repeatedly on D and gets 2 penalties in the first 10 minutes of the game, then plays like a scared kitten the rest of the game and is useless on D. She is not one of the best 6 players on the team. Maybe she was on her PWA team, but not U12. She talks trash in the locker room, swears a lot, says things like "Girls hockey sucks, boys hockey is way better..." The girls want her to go away but they're stuck with her for the rest of the summer.
My Conclusion: Girls playing PeeWee hockey is a waste of time and they lose a year of development. And just because they're playing for a better team than a typical U12A team doesn't mean they'd be a top U12 player.

[observer]

Ah, Roger, you're wrong. Even if you weren't your post is a pretty goofy generalization. Every association situation is different but I'll say in terms of development 50 PWA practices are significantly more beneficial than 50 U12A practices. I can't imagine a PWA coach picking a girl for his team unless he was certain she could help and fit in and get along.

I'm sorry you've had some unusual experiences with individual girl players as I presume your post is based on your own situation. Ouch.

You can have your top U12A post, and not include U12 eligible players playing elsewhere, but believe me, several top girls are playing varsity, JV, boys PWA and PWB, and it's a pretty decent number in the metro alone. Most join girls AAA teams in the summer and from my experience they all get along just fine. Good girl players like other good girl players.

[Pens4]

Every association situation is different but I'll say in terms of development 50 PWA practices are significantly more beneficial than 50 U12A practices. I can't imagine a PWA coach picking a girl for his team unless he was certain she could help and fit in and get along.

Observer, To use your words..."Every association is different." I've coached the PWA and have the 12A's in EP. My 50 practices are the same for each...same checking skills...same IQ drills...same in-zone system...same 1 on 1 out of the box...same Canada Cup Drill. I would say that overall my girls team might have a higher hockey IQ than that PWA team.

This is probably for the Boyz vs Girls thread but it should be noted that for all the positive development that comes with competing with the boys...there are some negative effects that take some time to correct when the parents finally decide that they've taken their daughter as far as they can and let her move over to the girls side.

When the girls come over....We as coaches love the agressive play and the strength on the puck. They often have a higher tempo and greater urgency to their game. BUT, those two things also equal a terrible feel for time and space on the ice and controlling their speed. (I know this is a problem for half the boys in the state also). When handling the puck, they tend to run into trouble quicker and have less control of the play than an equally talented "girls only" player. It is a different talent used in girls hockey. A girls with good hands and puck protection skills can dominate a girls game. A boy with the same skills can still get blown out by a physically-bigger but less-skilled player.

The final difference I've notice is confidence. A PWA girl who has to battle every shift to make the safe play, or to not get beat, or ever make a mistake because she is playing under a microscope....she is one who never ventures to try something creative or maybe hold onto the puck for more than 5 seconds, or was counted on to score the big goal when the goalie is pulled. They can make the transition but it isn't that easy for some.

If my daughter had wanted to play on the Boyz side...I would have let her till through Squirts only. Again...every association is different.

[jollyroger]

......

You can have your top U12A post, and not include U12 eligible players playing elsewhere, but believe me, several top girls are playing varsity, JV, boys PWA and PWB, and it's a pretty decent number in the metro alone. Most join girls AAA teams in the summer and from my experience they all get along just fine. Good girl players like other good girl players.

No, I don't believe you. Hmmm....let's see....there's the girl from Irondale (10 pts -- doing very well, but only playing Varsity because Irondale has never had a U12A team and she had to play PWB last year) and....who else from a respectable Varsity program in the metro? And no serious HS program lets 7th graders play JV. And by the way, only a handful of JV teams play at a 'higher' level than the better U12A teams.

[mnhkylvr]

Pens is just checking out this thread to see if his kids on it! Leave him be! Ha!

[inthenet]

I agree with the girl from armstrong, very good player also.

I think it is fine to say U12 eligible on the girls side, I know there are some good ones playing JV and U14 as well. If the post is about the best U12s in the state, the players on the boys or JV teams might be ones alot of youth girls coaches and players have not seen.

Armstrong PWA has a really good girl plays some wing and defense. Fast and good vision, she will be an inpact player in the future.

I think the 7th grader on Hill Murray JV is U12 eligible, she has great speed and hands.

[blondegirlsdad]

I wouldn't take what Pens said lightly, he does coach one of the best Girls teams in the state (last year they were probably the best at the U10 level).

God knows we can't beat 'em...

I've observed a couple girls who moved over in our association, they were good in Boys, and now they're good in Girls. Meanwhile, I don't know of too many girls who don't prefer the social side of playing with the girls. These kids get to be very very close friends, way better than they'd be with Boys their age.

So much depends on the coaching inside your association. We are so blessed to have solid coaching here, they obviously do in EP, and Wayzata, and Lakeville, and a lot of other places. But many associations haven't found a way to equalize their coaching between boys and girls, and it's pretty hard to argue that a girl wouldn't be better off skating for a better coach.

If you have the coaches in your association, I tend to agree that there aren't many advantages to playing with the boys, and some potential disadvantages.

(edited: And I just noticed that this is in the U12 players to watch thread and not the Girls/Boys thread - sorry)

[pitbull]

it is very interesting that so many are having a tough time naming the stand out players that are actually playing the 12U level. Are ALL of the strong players playing with the boys? What is this telling us?

[U10Father]

it is very interesting that so many are having a tough time naming the stand out players that are actually playing the 12U level. Are ALL of the strong players playing with the boys? What is this telling us?

Umm no. We just don't feel like putting the names of 11 and 12 year old girls out there is a great move.

There are dozens and dozens of great players, no need to start a recruiting watch here.

[pitbull]

some are obviously interested in knowing who they are or it wouldn't have been a topic and there wouldn't have been any responses

[jollyroger]

it is very interesting that so many are having a tough time naming the stand out players that are actually playing the 12U level. Are ALL of the strong players playing with the boys? What is this telling us?

Umm no. We just don't feel like putting the names of 11 and 12 year old girls out there is a great move.

There are dozens and dozens of great players, no need to start a recruiting watch here.

Exactly. The U12 coaches, managers and many of us who have followed U12 for two years and who have been to MN Selects, the Preview Classic, Midwest Selects, etc., could probably rattle off the top 25 players in the metro (at least by team and # if not name) without a problem. But no, names of these kids don't belong on a public forum. They can wait a couple more years.

[royals dad]

" And no serious HS program lets 7th graders play JV. "

Sorry JR but you are very wrong, some great 7th graders on top ten varsity teams JV squads.

[jollyroger]

" And no serious HS program lets 7th graders play JV. "

Sorry JR but you are very wrong, some great 7th graders on top ten varsity teams JV squads.

OK, who?
Stillwater, no. Roseville, no. H-M, no. Edina, no. WBL, no.
I admit I haven't watched much JV hockey this year, but the above programs have policies against 7th graders playing JV for a very good reason--it's not productive for the kid or the program. I would assume most 'top ten' programs would have a similar policy. And after you get out of the best 10-12 HS teams, a 'great' 7th grader would be playing Varsity (see Irondale). Get out of the top-20, and above-average 7th graders are playing Varsity (I won't mention who I'm thinking of).
My point is, of all the best first-year U12s from 2007-2008, as far as I can tell they are all back in U12 this year with a couple exceptions. Plus a few who gave PeeWees a shot for a year are now in U12. If there are any undiscovered gems out there at the JV level it's got to be one or two at most.
One other point, if teams (public schools) are in the top ten at the Varsity level, they almost always have strong youth teams behind them where kids can be successful and don't mind sticking around at least through U12. There is one glaring exception this year.

[Homer]

Hill does have a 7th grader. The coaches kid, and she is doing very well

" And no serious HS program lets 7th graders play JV. "

Sorry JR but you are very wrong, some great 7th graders on top ten varsity teams JV squads.

OK, who?
e, no. H-MStillwater, no. Rosevill, no. Edina, no. WBL, no.
I admit I haven't watched much JV hockey this year, but the above programs have policies against 7th graders playing JV for a very good reason--it's not productive for the kid or the program. I would assume most 'top ten' programs would have a similar policy. And after you get out of the best 10-12 HS teams, a 'great' 7th grader would be playing Varsity (see Irondale). Get out of the top-20, and above-average 7th graders are playing Varsity (I won't mention who I'm thinbest first-year U12s from 2007-2008, as far as I can tell they are all back in U12 this year with a couple exceptionsking of).
My point is, of all the . Plus a few who gave PeeWees a shot for a year are now in U12. If there are any undiscovered gems out there at the JV level it's got to be one or two at most.
One other point, if teams (public schools) are in the top ten at the Varsity level, they almost always have strong youth teams behind them where kids can be successful and don't mind sticking around at least through U12. There is one glaring exception this year.

[Rocket78]

Dodds from DC is the top ranked varsity 7th grader (#206 in points) this season to date. DC and RW each have 7th graders ranked at #290 and #291. Neither DC or RW have 14UA teams and I think DC's 12U team is mostly 10 yr olds so it made sense for them to go. I'm not sure why they didn't waive to Roch youth. RW has 12UB with no A.

[Pens4]

Dodds from DC is the top ranked varsity 7th grader (#206 in points) this season to date. DC and RW each have 7th graders ranked at #290 and #291. Neither DC or RW have 14UA teams and I think DC's 12U team is mostly 10 yr olds so it made sense for them to go. I'm not sure why they didn't waive to Roch youth. RW has 12UB with no A.

This deserves its own thread. I know there are at least a few parents that have visited this new site that have younger girls (7th & 8th graders)playing with their high school at either the varsity or JV. I know that mnhkylvr; homer and Rocket78 have daughters playing at that level and have tons of insight into the pro's and cons associated with that decision.

I DO NOT think it is similair a Bantam leaving to play JV...that I think is a poor decision for both hockey-wise and socially when leaving a strong Bantam program. But 14A or 12A is often a diffent story as far as hockey developement....my concern is the social aspect. How does a 7th-8th grader blend in socially with a senior or even a sophomore? I would appreciate some prospective on this.

[Homer]

Sorry Pens, my daughter is at the u14a level. I do let her decide where she wants to play.
Personally I am glad she is playing 14's. I feel it is better in her case, more playing time and more games for her.35-40 games at 14's as opposed to 25-27 at the h.s. level.
I feel too many kids are in too big a hurry to get on the H.S. teams. White Bear has an 8th grader playing varsity. She is playing 3rd line and I dont believe she has more than 10 points. When the bench gets shortened where does that leave the 3rd line? She would be better served playing top line in the u14's.

One last thing that might slow the exodus to H.S. would be to bring back u15. There aren't enough girls to have u14 and u16 teams, plus it would give some bubble type freshman a chance to play if they don't make H.S. and they are too old for 14's. This would add to the numbers and probably increase the competition.

[OntheEdge]

Every association situation is different but I'll say in terms of development 50 PWA practices are significantly more beneficial than 50 U12A practices. I can't imagine a PWA coach picking a girl for his team unless he was certain she could help and fit in and get along.

Observer, To use your words..."Every association is different." I've coached the PWA and have the 12A's in EP. My 50 practices are the same for each...same checking skills...same IQ drills...same in-zone system...same 1 on 1 out of the box...same Canada Cup Drill. I would say that overall my girls team might have a higher hockey IQ than that PWA team.

This is probably for the Boyz vs Girls thread but it should be noted that for all the positive development that comes with competing with the boys...there are some negative effects that take some time to correct when the parents finally decide that they've taken their daughter as far as they can and let her move over to the girls side.

When the girls come over....We as coaches love the agressive play and the strength on the puck. They often have a higher tempo and greater urgency to their game. BUT, those two things also equal a terrible feel for time and space on the ice and controlling their speed. (I know this is a problem for half the boys in the state also). When handling the puck, they tend to run into trouble quicker and have less control of the play than an equally talented "girls only" player. It is a different talent used in girls hockey. A girls with good hands and puck protection skills can dominate a girls game. A boy with the same skills can still get blown out by a physically-bigger but less-skilled player.

The final difference I've notice is confidence. A PWA girl who has to battle every shift to make the safe play, or to not get beat, or ever make a mistake because she is playing under a microscope....she is one who never ventures to try something creative or maybe hold onto the puck for more than 5 seconds, or was counted on to score the big goal when the goalie is pulled. They can make the transition but it isn't that easy for some.

If my daughter had wanted to play on the Boyz side...I would have let her till through Squirts only. Again...every association is different.

Good post. I agree. The only reason I would let my daughter play boys beyond squirts is if there wasn't an A team at the girls level. I've seen too many girls play through Peewees go to girls HS and spend a couple of years struggling to learn to play the girls game.

[hockeylegend23]

I know that three, maybe even four girls on the U14 AAA Bulldogs are 96's and are dominating at the 95 level.
#2, #9 and #5 are their numbers.