Where should the Section 6A final be played?

HasNoMoves · Post by **HasNoMoves** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 11:28 am

can anyone tell me...is the section final for 6A for sure being played at the MAC in st. cloud, or have the "top" schools entertained the thought of moving this game to the National Hockey Center? i understand the difference in ice size does drastically change the game, especially at the highschool level, but anyone who was at the MAC last year I think would agree it was not a big enough venue for a great section final matchup like we will have this year again...

scarface · Post by **scarface** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 4:12 pm

Would be nice to play at NHC but I don't see it happening. It was packed at last years final and I'm sure with the run LF has gotten this year that game will attract alot of hockey fans that aren't associated with either team in the finals.

defense · Post by **defense** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 5:58 pm

HasNoMoves wrote:can anyone tell me...is the section final for 6A for sure being played at the MAC in st. cloud, or have the "top" schools entertained the thought of moving this game to the National Hockey Center? i understand the difference in ice size does drastically change the game, especially at the highschool level, but anyone who was at the MAC last year I think would agree it was not a big enough venue for a great section final matchup like we will have this year again...

I would probably guess not, and I'm not in favor of it. Yes, the mac will be packed. The Runestone used to get packed too. I don't think that the National Hockey Center would become full enough to: Be worth it to play in that arena, and create a decent atmosphere such as these games deserve. Section 6a should continue to use buildings the size of the mac, but I don't know if the mac is the answer. The section 6 semi's and finals were in Alexandria untill the year that Alex got put into this section, was this because Alex had a home ice advantage???? or was it coincidence?? I don't know either way because the mac is home ice to Apollo High School correct???? In my opinion they should look at the Moorhead Sports Center or a rotation type system as they do or did in section 8a.

4theloveofthegame · Post by **4theloveofthegame** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 12:59 am

The problem with the NHC is the ice. Terrible Skating surface. Very soft and slow. It would be a terrible place to showcase the speed in the section. Also, It's an Olympic size rink, which would be different from every other rink this section has skated on.It should stay where it is, at the MAC.

scarface · Post by **scarface** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 7:50 am

4theloveofthegame wrote:The problem with the NHC is the ice. Terrible Skating surface. Very soft and slow. It would be a terrible place to showcase the speed in the section. Also, It's an Olympic size rink, which would be different from every other rink this section has skated on.It should stay where it is, at the MAC.

Since I haven't played at NHC I wasn't aware of the ice situation. All good points you make and my point about playing there really only stems from the "prestige" factor in playing at the NHC for the kids. Not sure how much of a factor that is as most of these kids have played on some "big league" sheets coming up.

The MAC will be buzzin that's for sure.

Stealth · Post by **Stealth** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 8:53 am

4theloveofthegame wrote:The problem with the NHC is the ice. Terrible Skating surface. Very soft and slow. It would be a terrible place to showcase the speed in the section. Also, It's an Olympic size rink, which would be different from every other rink this section has skated on.It should stay where it is, at the MAC.

Dido,
Alexandria ice does not set up and bad cooling by the Zamboni net area. Nice classic building. Needs more lighting?
Sauk Center ??? heard it cold so good ice?
Willmar is Crap ice, stupid to have teams head there when not in section. Nice addition thou!
Mac new ice this year, was slow in past so don’t hear much now? Has seating. The best place for this.
NHC, soft and slow. Would be too big. Ego’s happening here ?
Bernick, good ice. Seating problem. Never finished off like Monticello rink. Good lighting. Only one with seamless glass?
East,; great ice, but you have to go outside to warm up and miss the game?
Little Falls. Good ice. But lighting seems dull, seating problem.
Fergus Fall, ice is ok, not central for fans. and who can figure out Howard on the ice?
Brainerd, just a box building. No atmosphere. seating

MAC WINS!

HasNoMoves · Post by **HasNoMoves** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 10:24 am

i played in section final games at the NHC in class A, and there were plenty of fans...this will be a great section final game this year, and it would be a huge mistake to have it at the MAC...the section/schools will be leaving a lot of money on the table by not selling as many tickets...they would have no problem drawing 4000-4500 fans for this game...MAC is 2000...2500 at best! not enough bathrooms at the mac, not enough concession stands...and sorry, but i dont want to be cramped in the stands trying to enjoy a great game like this. ps..the ice is fine at the NHC...its plenty hard and fast...not as fast as some of the crappy pole barns that people are used to playing in in section 6A for home games, but its great ice nonetheless...you want slow ice...try the Xcel Center...pretty soft, but i don't think you will hear players complaining about playing there...

darkdemon · Post by **darkdemon** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 11:10 am

The MAC is perfect for this size section it creates a better atmosphere and is a better arena, because of its excellent staff and cleanliness. And yes the NHC has terrible ice it is soft and the z-drivers dont cut enough.

theblandyman · Post by **theblandyman** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 11:24 am

darkdemon wrote:The MAC is perfect for this size section it creates a better atmosphere and is a better arena, because of its excellent staff and cleanliness. And yes the NHC has terrible ice it is soft and the z-drivers dont cut enough.

well thank you.

As for the guy who said that they could easily get 4000-4500 people...I highly doubt it.

darkdemon · Post by **darkdemon** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 11:44 am

theblandyman wrote:
darkdemon wrote:The MAC is perfect for this size section it creates a better atmosphere and is a better arena, because of its excellent staff and cleanliness. And yes the NHC has terrible ice it is soft and the z-drivers dont cut enough.
well thank you.

As for the guy who said that they could easily get 4000-4500 people...I highly doubt it.

No problem dude keep that scoreboard runnin

defense · Post by **defense** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 1:19 pm

darkdemon wrote:
theblandyman wrote:
darkdemon wrote:The MAC is perfect for this size section it creates a better atmosphere and is a better arena, because of its excellent staff and cleanliness. And yes the NHC has terrible ice it is soft and the z-drivers dont cut enough.
well thank you.

As for the guy who said that they could easily get 4000-4500 people...I highly doubt it.
No problem dude keep that scoreboard runnin

According to the MSHSL web site, the 2008 class A state tourenement SESSION attendance was as follows:

Wednesday afternoon quarters: 5457 (2 games)
Wednesday evening quarters : 6086 (2 games)
Friday afternoon semifinals : 9867 (2 games)
Saturday afternoon 3rd place and championship: (7380)

Tickets for the state tournement are for two game sessions this means that fans for 4 different teams showed up. There always is just plain fans who come to all or many different games. It is doubtfull that the total # in attendance in a session were all in the arena at one time.
Considering these facts of the STATE TOURNEY, I would be highly doubtfull that 4000 to 5000 would show up for a Section 6a championship game even if it was held in the National Hockey Center.

HasNoMoves · Post by **HasNoMoves** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 3:42 pm

anyone who was at the mac last year would have to convince me why it was such a great venue for the fans...it was horrendous...too crowded...not enough bathroom, not enough concessions...and if you got up..well..there went your seat...good luck getting it back...not very enjoyable to watch a great game....looks like this poll favors NHC 2-1....i wish more people would voice their dissaproval of the MAC to the section coaches and athletic directors.

HasNoMoves · Post by **HasNoMoves** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 3:49 pm

also...i get your state tourney attendence results...however i think more familes would make the half hour trip to st. cloud from LF and the hour trim from alex...if those are the 2 teams in the final..then drive another hour and a half past st. cloud to go to the game...plus a lot of local people in st. cloud would attend also that otherwise wouldnt drop more money to go to the state tourney and deal with traffic, ticket costs, parking etc....so your argument is pretty weak, but good job googling the tourney attendence lol

defense · Post by **defense** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 2:57 am

HasNoMoves wrote:also...i get your state tourney attendence results...however i think more familes would make the half hour trip to st. cloud from LF and the hour trim from alex...if those are the 2 teams in the final..then drive another hour and a half past st. cloud to go to the game...plus a lot of local people in st. cloud would attend also that otherwise wouldnt drop more money to go to the state tourney and deal with traffic, ticket costs, parking etc....so your argument is pretty weak, but good job googling the tourney attendence lol

Do you honestly beleive that if the section 6a final was held in the National Hockey Center a good number of St. Cloud families would attend this event and not the State Tournement??????? And with a strait face, you're going to go on record saying that a meaningful INCREASE in attendance would be due to extra families driving to St. Cloud to watch the game in the NHC, that then wouldn't find it necassary to travel to St. Paul... You're right, the next time the Otters make it that far, I will be calling Mr. Shueller down at the high school's AD office every day untill he gets that section final changed to the NHC so that I won't have to drive to the Cities to see them play in the state tournement.....

You're right my argument is weak...man, think of the money I would've saved.....
By the way, the web site is www.mshsl.org....no need to google....

HShockeywatcher · Post by **HShockeywatcher** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:23 am

defense,
he made some of the points I was going to make. I haven't attended a state tournament for a couple years now but I have attended local section games. The state tournament is televised all over the state. This section final game is not.

I referenced the site you cited, www.mshsl.org, and found that the section 6A final is held at 7PM at NIGHT on a Thursday. The Class A state games are held during the day while people are at work. If Little Falls makes it, I believe they will get the #2 seed, giving them games at 11AM on a Wednesday and a Friday.

If you compare the times, distances, paying for parking, dealing with traffic and the fact that the state games are televised there is no way to know for sure what the difference in attendance would be.

You are right, I'm guessing 4500 people is a little much, but if Alex and Little Falls are in this game, it's very possible they will overfill the MAC.
I've been a part of the St Thomas/Cretin rivalry for years, and going to a football, hockey or basketball game between the two is nuts. Luckily, the hockey games in recent years have been televised and they still sell out. They played in football 7 or 8 years ago I believe and the attendance at St Thomas was 6000 or 7000 for the one game. If you compared this attendance to the state tournament you may come up with similar results you have. When rivalry games occur and there is a venue to hold people, they fill up.

HasNoMoves · Post by **HasNoMoves** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:30 am

HShockeywatcher..thank you, i feel you explained my point better than i did...given the time of the game, lack of television etc, i just feel the MAC is not big enough..its a greta place to play, but a little small for a game this size.

Stealth · Post by **Stealth** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:12 am

HShockeywatcher,
Stupid to bring in Football, small schools must have 80 to 90+ kids on the bench and how manny see the feild during play. Does the big school program have even more kids blocking (the wind) for the starters?

Let's see;
Bring mom, dad little brothers sisters, probly both grand parents, uncles and aunt and even kids & parents friends hoping to see little HShockeywather play. NOW TIMES THAT BY TWO TEAMS! $$$$$$
Bingo!
That is why they do not CUT in football! Every kid has to do FUND raising,

Then do the math with the gate and concessions on a nice fall night outdoors before the winter comes. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$

The only other activity is Soccer that I can think of that has numbers of kids in it and they even started charging a gate fee now. Do they cut?

Will Little Falls and Alex have that many people next year in attendance in hockey? Let alone even on this forum board?

It changes every year.

The MAC will work year after year, nothing special needs to be done here for any team.

defense · Post by **defense** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:18 am

HasNoMoves wrote:HShockeywatcher..thank you, i feel you explained my point better than i did...given the time of the game, lack of television etc, i just feel the MAC is not big enough..its a greta place to play, but a little small for a game this size.

I already said you guys are ..ahem....right

I will surely not be going to watch my favorite play in the state tournement...ahem...

if the game is played in the National Hockey Center......

HShockeywatcher · Post by **HShockeywatcher** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:26 am

Stealth, are you seriously trying to argue that a football arena made to seat 1000-2000 people (not sure exactly) sold 3-4x their seating capacity because of family members coming to the game? If there are 100 people on each team and each has two parents, two grandparents and a sibling in attendance that's only 1000 people. You couldn't sound more silly.

I also commented on how the St Thomas/Cretin game is sold out every year. If you watch it on FSN they also comment on that. Building the St Thomas Ice Arena with stands on one side was a huge mistake. The place they play is not big enough, whether it be in st paul or in mendota heights. They simply need a bigger venue. Just like this 6A match up.

defense, show me where in any of my posts or HasNoMoves's posts we suggested having the state tournament at the NHC. If you can do that I vow to never post again. Nice try though

Post by **karl(east)** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:27 am

Well, let's try comparing this to another situation.

The last time Duluth East and Cloquet played in a section final, there were about 5,000 people in attendance (just a tiny bit short of a sellout at the DECC).
-The game was played during East's winter break
-DE-Cloquet is a somewhat more established rivalry than LF-Alex
-The combined enrollment of DE and the CEC coop is about 200-300 more than that of LF and Alex.
-There might be an A vs. AA issue here.

Based on that, I could see a LF-Alex final ideally drawing 3-4 thousand.

defense · Post by **defense** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:31 am

HasNoMoves wrote:also...i get your state tourney attendence results...however i think more familes would make the half hour trip to st. cloud from LF and the hour trim from alex...if those are the 2 teams in the final..then drive another hour and a half past st. cloud to go to the game...plus a lot of local people in st. cloud would attend also that otherwise wouldnt drop more money to go to the state tourney and deal with traffic, ticket costs, parking etc....so your argument is pretty weak, but good job googling the tourney attendence lol

Pretty simple if you passed 4th grade reading class.......

PS I don't even have to try....

HShockeywatcher · Post by **HShockeywatcher** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 7:40 pm

Still haven't found where either of us said that, have you?

defense · Post by **defense** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 8:03 pm

HShockeywatcher wrote:Still haven't found where either of us said that, have you?

Nope, and I never implied such a thing...

reading and comprehension....

$t0n3WaLL3021 · Post by **$t0n3WaLL3021** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 8:50 pm

HasNoMoves wrote:anyone who was at the mac last year would have to convince me why it was such a great venue for the fans...it was horrendous...too crowded...not enough bathroom, not enough concessions...and if you got up..well..there went your seat...good luck getting it back...not very enjoyable to watch a great game....looks like this poll favors NHC 2-1....i wish more people would voice their dissaproval of the MAC to the section coaches and athletic directors.

I've played both rinks for my entire life...the mac is much better than nhc for high school hockey. The ice at nhc is terribly soft and slow, where as the mac's ice is smooth fast and hard. Although the mac might get packed for these games, that's what creates such a get atmosphere. I was at the game and it was perfect. If played at nhc, there would not be enough fans and the game's pace would be killed. Finally, this conversation doesn't matter, because it WILL NOT get changed to nhc.

dherman8 · Post by **dherman8** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:03 pm

I want to know if any section 6A fans were at the LF Game last Friday night? I drove down 27 at around 9 and saw all the cars on the side of the road that were parked almost up to the stoplight by the Coborns. Could have they fit anymore people in the Exchange Arena that night?

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