Top Five Coaches Both classes

[old goalie85]

Whos the best? Wins, Motivator, Buider of the program,Class,

[Ugottobekiddingme]

Whos the best? Wins, Motivator, Buider of the program,Class,

Does this post also include the ability to spell, use correct grammar, and punctuation....my vote goes to coach Jules Winfield...a man that was a shepherd and the remaining coaches are just part of the flock.

[old goalie85]

No spelling, or grammer. Just opinion.

[ehshockey]

1. Giles
2. Terwilliger
3. Blooston
4. Langevin
5. Beaupre

[muckandgrind]

No list would be complete without Bill Lechner.

[RinkRat8890]

I would say Urick from Minnetonka would have to be on the list, he has gone to three section championships and one state tournament in 3 seasons and he had two seasons of only losing two games.

[thebookmark]

I would say Urick from Minnetonka would have to be on the list, he has gone to three section championships and one state tournament in 3 seasons and he had two seasons of only losing two games.

The Urick duo has to be on there. Joe Urick (defensive coach for the skippers) currently has 6 players who have graduated his team with D1 scholeys.

[MrBoDangles]

Whos the best? Wins, Motivator, Buider of the program,Class,

Does this post also include the ability to spell, use correct grammar, and punctuation....my vote goes to coach Jules Winfield...a man that was a shepherd and the remaining coaches are just part of the flock.

Do you think you're being funny? Pull your pants up a little higher Eugene. ....................

[seek & destroy]

Whos the best? Wins, Motivator, Buider of the program,Class,

Does this post also include the ability to spell, use correct grammar, and punctuation....my vote goes to coach Jules Winfield...a man that was a shepherd and the remaining coaches are just part of the flock.

Do you think you're being funny? Pull your pants up a little higher Eugene. ....................

It never gets old...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKOBqH8pQaQ

[slyer]

i would think sarsland from from elk river would be up there, 1 state championship and a few other places from a town of about 15,000.

[karl(east)]

Here are a few awards I'd hand out in AA--they're my opinion, and I don't know much about many of the situations, but I'll throw them out there for discussion:

-Most wins: Lorne Grosso, Rochester Mayo
-Award for building programs from the ground up: Ken Pauly, Benilde (also for his work at Minnetonka)
-Best system coach: Tony Sarsland, Elk River
-Gets the most out of the least talent: Dave Esse, Cloquet
Honorable mention: Janne Kivihalme, Burnsville (not that they don't have some decent talent in that program)
-Best use of star players: Lee Smith, Eden Prairie
-Most popular: Wes Bolin, Woodbury (Not a word of complaint on this forum, despite some underachievement compared to expectations in recent years)
-Survivor award: Tim Sager, White Bear Lake (no effort made here to judge the charges against him--I'm merely recognizing his ability to hold onto his job)
Honorable mention: Curt Giles, Edina
-Best overall resume for an active coach: Mike Randolph, Duluth East
(could also qualify for the 'survivor' award)
Best coach in state: Bill Lechner, Hill-Murray

Others who deserve a mention: Dave Aus, Blaine; Greg Trebil, Holy Angels; Burce LaRoque, Grand Rapids; Brian Urick, Minnetonka

[slyer]

randolph would also be up there

[UntouchableFlow]

1.Lechner-For obvious reasons, consistently has a great defensive team, and knows how to get the best out of his players every year.

2. Giles-Experience playing in the pros has translated into a good job coaching. Couldn't get it done with the Lee, Budish, Everson combo, but took a team without any division-1 commitments and won state.

3. Pauly-Should receive some credit for the direction that Minnetonka has gone in the past few seasons. Brought them to state in his first season, and has helped develop some great players throughout the past years at his current job.

4. Aus-Gets a lot of productivity out of his teams. He was given a lot of talent the past few seasons and made them a great team. Will be interesting to see how he does this year without a real "superstar".

5. Toss up between Urick/Smith/Randolph

[SoftMitts]

After watching the state semi final last year it was clear to me it is Lechner.

[BodyShots]

Here are a few awards I'd hand out in AA--they're my opinion, and I don't know much about many of the situations, but I'll throw them out there for discussion:

-Most wins: Lorne Grosso, Rochester Mayo
-Award for building programs from the ground up: Ken Pauly, Benilde (also for his work at Minnetonka)
-Best system coach: Tony Sarsland, Elk River-Gets the most out of the least talent: Dave Esse, CloquetHonorable mention: Janne Kivihalme, Burnsville (not that they don't have some decent talent in that program)
-Best use of star players: Lee Smith, Eden Prairie
-Most popular: Wes Bolin, Woodbury (Not a word of complaint on this forum, despite some underachievement compared to expectations in recent years)
-Survivor award: Tim Sager, White Bear Lake (no effort made here to judge the charges against him--I'm merely recognizing his ability to hold onto his job)
Honorable mention: Curt Giles, Edina
-Best overall resume for an active coach: Mike Randolph, Duluth East(could also qualify for the 'survivor' award)
Best coach in state: Bill Lechner, Hill-Murray

Others who deserve a mention: Dave Aus, Blaine; Greg Trebil, Holy Angels; Burce LaRoque, Grand Rapids; Brian Urick, Minnetonka

What...no awards for Forest Lake, Cambridge, and the rest of the 7AA coaches. YOU HOMER!

As for these awards. Do you people ever realize the assocations with the strongest programs are also producing the top high school teams The only teams this doesn't hold true for, are the privates....because they don't have just one association building them.

Lets see, Edina, Wayzata, Duluth East, Tonka, EP, have had the strongest A PEEWEE and A BANTAM teams for many years running. Woodbury has been strong recently, but they added another high school, so I will give them a pass.

Give the awards to those that do the most...with the least. Until I see one of these loaded communities become a dynasty and win several state titles in a short period of time, they don't deserve the title of top five coaches.

[karl(east)]

As for these awards. Do you people ever realize the assocations with the strongest programs are also producing the top high school teams The only teams this doesn't hold true for, are the privates....because they don't have just one association building them.

Lets see, Edina, Wayzata, Duluth East, Tonka, EP, have had the strongest A PEEWEE and A BANTAM teams for many years running. Woodbury has been strong recently, but they added another high school, so I will give them a pass.

I think there are still very good reasons to recognize a lot of these programs.

Take Duluth East, for example. They have something like 58 straight winning seasons. The high school program has obviously always been among the best in the state. They pumped out several great players in the 70s and 80s. But in the 22 years prior to Mike Randolph's arrival (88/89 season), they made a grand total of one state tournament appearance. In the 22 since his arrival, they've made 12. That's a pretty obvious correlation; Lee could tell you more stories on that front if you want to hear them.

You note that a strong youth system is important, but often the great high school coaches play a huge role in forming that. It's what made Ikola great at Edina, and Saterdalen great at Jefferson. Again, Randolph qualifies, and I think Ken Pauly deserves credit for helping Minnetonka realize its potential. Their history is not all that illustrious.

I also think it's a lot harder to manage a top-end team than some people realize. The pressure is much heavier, and there is so much parity in AA these days that it's hard to build a legitimate dynasty. (If we use that as our criteria, are there any great coaches in MN hockey today?) Also, on a thin team, it's not too hard to throw out your top line every other shift and ride them to death. But when a coach has to sort thorugh a mountain of talent, create the right line combinations, figure out how to balance playing time of the better players with the younger ones they're trying to develop, it gets complicated.

Many of the coaches listed here got a lot of flak rather recently for their supposed inabilities: Smith, Giles, even Lechner. Davis at Wayzata--another school with a very deep feeder program--still does.

Even when a team has the most talent in the state, there are a lot of ways to screw it up. When was the last time the "most talented" team won a state title? I don't remember. I do think Giles deserved some of the criticism he got for failing to win a title with that great group a few years ago. But he learned from that, and deserves credit for it.

[supertacks]

As for these awards. Do you people ever realize the assocations with the strongest programs are also producing the top high school teams The only teams this doesn't hold true for, are the privates....because they don't have just one association building them.

Lets see, Edina, Wayzata, Duluth East, Tonka, EP, have had the strongest A PEEWEE and A BANTAM teams for many years running. Woodbury has been strong recently, but they added another high school, so I will give them a pass.

I think there are still very good reasons to recognize a lot of these programs.

Take Duluth East, for example. They have something like 58 straight winning seasons. The high school program has obviously always been among the best in the state. They pumped out several great players in the 70s and 80s. But in the 22 years prior to Mike Randolph's arrival (88/89 season), they made a grand total of one state tournament appearance. In the 22 since his arrival, they've made 12. That's a pretty obvious correlation; Lee could tell you more stories on that front if you want to hear them.

You note that a strong youth system is important, but often the great high school coaches play a huge role in forming that. It's what made Ikola great at Edina, and Saterdalen great at Jefferson. Again, Randolph qualifies, and I think Ken Pauly deserves credit for helping Minnetonka realize its potential. Their history is not all that illustrious.

I also think it's a lot harder to manage a top-end team than some people realize. The pressure is much heavier, and there is so much parity in AA these days that it's hard to build a legitimate dynasty. (If we use that as our criteria, are there any great coaches in MN hockey today?) Also, on a thin team, it's not too hard to throw out your top line every other shift and ride them to death. But when a coach has to sort thorugh a mountain of talent, create the right line combinations, figure out how to balance playing time of the better players with the younger ones they're trying to develop, it gets complicated.

Many of the coaches listed here got a lot of flak rather recently for their supposed inabilities: Smith, Giles, even Lechner. Davis at Wayzata--another school with a very deep feeder program--still does.

Even when a team has the most talent in the state, there are a lot of ways to screw it up. When was the last time the "most talented" team won a state title? I don't remember. I do think Giles deserved some of the criticism he got for failing to win a title with that great group a few years ago. But he learned from that, and deserves credit for it.

Very well stated Karl!

[mnmouth]

This one's not close. Give Randolph the talent that Lechner or Giles has had recently and you'd be looking at multiple championships. The guy does a better job of preparing his teams for big games than any coach around. Take last year's qtr. against Hill. Hounds were all over Lechner's club, then a funny little bounce along the boards leads to an easy goal for Hill and the momentum shifts. Hounds have not had the top-end talent recently that their teams did from '94-'98, but it appears they may have it again. Watch out.

[slyer]

are you serious,if i remember correctly they did have a mr. hockey finalist NOT to long ago. duluth always has talent, bigger city,more players to choose from and home ice in sections. he's a good coach but...

[BodyShots]

As for these awards. Do you people ever realize the assocations with the strongest programs are also producing the top high school teams The only teams this doesn't hold true for, are the privates....because they don't have just one association building them.

Lets see, Edina, Wayzata, Duluth East, Tonka, EP, have had the strongest A PEEWEE and A BANTAM teams for many years running. Woodbury has been strong recently, but they added another high school, so I will give them a pass.

I think there are still very good reasons to recognize a lot of these programs.

Take Duluth East, for example. They have something like 58 straight winning seasons. The high school program has obviously always been among the best in the state. They pumped out several great players in the 70s and 80s. But in the 22 years prior to Mike Randolph's arrival (88/89 season), they made a grand total of one state tournament appearance. In the 22 since his arrival, they've made 12. That's a pretty obvious correlation; Lee could tell you more stories on that front if you want to hear them.

You note that a strong youth system is important, but often the great high school coaches play a huge role in forming that. It's what made Ikola great at Edina, and Saterdalen great at Jefferson. Again, Randolph qualifies, and I think Ken Pauly deserves credit for helping Minnetonka realize its potential. Their history is not all that illustrious.

I also think it's a lot harder to manage a top-end team than some people realize. The pressure is much heavier, and there is so much parity in AA these days that it's hard to build a legitimate dynasty. (If we use that as our criteria, are there any great coaches in MN hockey today?) Also, on a thin team, it's not too hard to throw out your top line every other shift and ride them to death. But when a coach has to sort thorugh a mountain of talent, create the right line combinations, figure out how to balance playing time of the better players with the younger ones they're trying to develop, it gets complicated.

Many of the coaches listed here got a lot of flak rather recently for their supposed inabilities: Smith, Giles, even Lechner. Davis at Wayzata--another school with a very deep feeder program--still does.

Even when a team has the most talent in the state, there are a lot of ways to screw it up. When was the last time the "most talented" team won a state title? I don't remember. I do think Giles deserved some of the criticism he got for failing to win a title with that great group a few years ago. But he learned from that, and deserves credit for it.

And how many consecutive winning seasons has the "A" Bantam team had up in Duluth? 12 out of 22 state tournament appearances doesn't sound that great to me. How many state tournaments have the "A" Bantam team been too during that same period.

Ikola is probably the greatest coach of all time. He developed dynasty's and won championships consistantly.

So, is it tougher to coach a team with 7 elite players or one with none? Do you think Tonka had a tough time with 4 D1 defenseman on his roster last year? Let me see, its a close game and I'm sorry, but D5 and D6 aren't going to play very much! Watch and learn!

I've coached numerous hockey and baseball teams over the years, and I have had some loaded teams, and weak teams. From experience, its a lot easier coaching a loaded team than it is to coach a weak team.

Here is one for debate. Who is the better coach? A coach whose team goes undefeated, beats teams by running time the first time playing a team, and then beats them the second time by only a couple of goals. Or a coach who ends up the season with a .500 record, but loses the first game against opponents by a couple goals and then wins the rematch?

So who are the top 5 coaches? I don't know, because I don't follow every team close enough. But, a couple that come to mind recently would be Forest Lake and Mahtomedi. Teams that play youth hockey in District 2 and haven't experienced much success. Granted District 2 isn't a powerhouse, but these teams usually finish in the middle or near the bottom. To see the success they have both obtained recently at the High School level is pretty impressive. Cudos to their coaches.

[karl(east)]

And how many consecutive winning seasons has the "A" Bantam team had up in Duluth? 12 out of 22 state tournament appearances doesn't sound that great to me. How many state tournaments have the "A" Bantam team been too during that same period.

Ikola is probably the greatest coach of all time. He developed dynasty's and won championships consistantly.

So, is it tougher to coach a team with 7 elite players or one with none? Do you think Tonka had a tough time with 4 D1 defenseman on his roster last year? Let me see, its a close game and I'm sorry, but D5 and D6 aren't going to play very much! Watch and learn!

I've coached numerous hockey and baseball teams over the years, and I have had some loaded teams, and weak teams. From experience, its a lot easier coaching a loaded team than it is to coach a weak team.

Here is one for debate. Who is the better coach? A coach whose team goes undefeated, beats teams by running time the first time playing a team, and then beats them the second time by only a couple of goals. Or a coach who ends up the season with a .500 record, but loses the first game against opponents by a couple goals and then wins the rematch?

So who are the top 5 coaches? I don't know, because I don't follow every team close enough. But, a couple that come to mind recently would be Forest Lake and Mahtomedi. Teams that play youth hockey in District 2 and haven't experienced much success. Granted District 2 isn't a powerhouse, but these teams usually finish in the middle or near the bottom. To see the success they have both obtained recently at the High School level is pretty impressive. Cudos to their coaches.

Not sure how many times East Bantam A has gone to state, nor do I think it's a good comparison, since D11 is weaker than 7AA. Those 12 state tourney appearances are tied with Hill for the most over that time period. East went from being an afterthought to a perennial power under Randolph--and they even switched into a harder section. (Section 2 in the 70s and 80s was a joke.) If that's not greatness, what is?

No question Ikola was the greatest better. But I'm equally convinced that an Ikola-esque run is impossible in AA today. Many other programs have caught up with Edina. We live in an age of parity, with few repeat champions. Coaches can do great jobs and still fall short 2 out of 3 years.

I won't say it's harder to coach a team with 7 elite players, but it can definitely be harder relative to expectations. If Hill doesn't make the state semifinals, their season will essentially be a flop. That's an incredible amount of pressure to put on anyone. If a coach has an incredible run of success, then sees things drop off, the leash becomes much shorter. The margin for error becomes incredibly small. There are countless examples.

If we want to pick on specific examples, yes, I'll agree Brian Urick had a pretty easy job last year. And yes, both Lechner and Giles outcoached him at State. I think that shows how hard it can be to win, even with lots of talent. And there are lots of questions that need answering. Of course late in a close game, a team with lots of top-end defensemen is going to ride them. But what about in the 2nd period of that game? What if the game is in early December? When do you push the panic button? How much can a team afford to focus on development as opposed to wins? Great coaches have answers to all those questions.

I did consider mentioning Aaron Forsythe at Flake (except that would be another 7AA coach, wouldn't it?) But he's relatively new, so I'm going to wait a little more time. And even though Flake has improved in recent years, there has been an influx of talent to go with it (Moberg, Fick, Kohls and the rest of his line.)

And I agree there are many different ways to measure success. (Though we shouldn't throw out the traditional ways, since that is what will be remembered, after all.) That's why I invented a bunch of random categories, instead of making a 1-10 list. Just becuase a coach is, say, the "best system coach" doesn't mean he's one of the best 10 coaches in the state. It just means he beats a certain sytem into his kids better than anyone else out there. That's part of why I praise Dave Esse at Cloquet so consistently--he took a team that was terrible at the start of last season, and by the end they were giving East and Andover 1-goal games, beat state runner-up Hermantown, and took #1 seed Elk River to 2 OT. He consistently does an amazing job with the parts he has, and Cloquet's latest run of success can also be traced directly back to his hiring.

That said, I have seen Esse be outcoached within games. I have never seen Bill Lechner be outcoached. That's why he's at #1 for me.


I will gladly listen to nominations for other coaches who consistently take bad teams and make them mediocre, or take mediocre teams and make them great (like Esse). But honestly, I don't think there are that many out there. That's why I focus on how well someone institutes a program-wide philosophy that endures (Randolph, Sarsland, Ikola, Saterdalen), or a coach's ability to win a big chess match (Lechner, Giles last year, though I think he has to repeat his feat to earn a spot among the elite).

Another note: I think coaches deserve credit if they can take a historically underachieving program and make it live up to expectations (Randolph, Pauly). It can be very, very hard to break a losing, "here we go again" mindset, no matter the talent that goes through it. No program exemplifies that better than White Bear Lake.

Good discussion; I'm enjoying it.

[salmonwheels]

Don't forget Jerry Diebel at North St Paul. He has been coaching the Polars for over 18 years.

[mnmouth]

are you serious,if i remember correctly they did have a mr. hockey finalist NOT to long ago. duluth always has talent, bigger city,more players to choose from and home ice in sections. he's a good coach but...

Of course I am serious. Having a Mr. Hockey finalist or coaching in a big city or at a big school means squat. If that were the case, Giles, Trebil, Lechner, et al would swap titles year after year. Back in the day, Hibbing had the largest enrollment on the Range and home ice every year in sectionals and went to state only occasionally.

Get a clue dude.

[black sheep]

surprising no 8aa coaches...maybe a little too much turnover lately.

No taters touting Moronville is odd...the spuds had some good runs under the guy just could'nt quite win it all. One of the most solid AA teams in the last 15-20 yrs or so.

[mnmouth]

surprising no 8aa coaches...maybe a little too much turnover lately.

No taters touting Moronville is odd...the spuds had some good runs under the guy just could'nt quite win it all. One of the most solid AA teams in the last 15-20 yrs or so.

The way you spell his name says it all - Morinville is a chump, just like every other Moorhead coach has been.