Minneapolis - Class A?

[gitter]

Can someone explain to me how Minneapolis is in class A? Top 64 by enrollment plus opt-ups are AA correct? According to the MSHSL the following Minneapolis schools make up the "Minneapolis Novas":

Minneapolis Edison High School (Enr. 448)
Minneapolis North Community H.S. (Enr. 126)
Minneapolis Patrick Henry H. S. (Enr. 697)
Minneapolis Roosevelt High School (Enr. 527)
Minneapolis South High School (Enr. 1409)
Minneapolis Southwest High School (HOST) (Enr. 1428)
Minneapolis Washburn High School (Enr. 999)

Is it not a combined enrollment figure for Co-ops? The combined enrollment for those schools is 5,634. Even just looking at the Host school, Mpls Southwest is the 44th largest school in the state by enrollment. I realize they are not good in hockey, but it kind of seems ridiculous that they are playing in Class A.

[SWPrez]

Can someone explain to me how Minneapolis is in class A? Top 64 by enrollment plus opt-ups are AA correct? According to the MSHSL the following Minneapolis schools make up the "Minneapolis Novas":

Minneapolis Edison High School (Enr. 448)
Minneapolis North Community H.S. (Enr. 126)
Minneapolis Patrick Henry H. S. (Enr. 697)
Minneapolis Roosevelt High School (Enr. 527)
Minneapolis South High School (Enr. 1409)
Minneapolis Southwest High School (HOST) (Enr. 1428)
Minneapolis Washburn High School (Enr. 999)

Is it not a combined enrollment figure for Co-ops? The combined enrollment for those schools is 5,634. Even just looking at the Host school, Mpls Southwest is the 44th largest school in the state by enrollment. I realize they are not good in hockey, but it kind of seems ridiculous that they are playing in Class A.

I was not involved, but I believe they petitioned the state to move down.

Minneapolis is pretty unique in that over the last decade, our top players end up filling the rosters at privates (Blake, Breck, Minnehaha, Benilde, Holy Angels, etc.). That limits our pool of players considerably for Minneapolis public schools. While the numbers show 5600+ students, the reality is they aren't hockey players. On the current varsity/JV, I believe the numbers are as follows:

Minneapolis Edison High School (Enr. 448) - 0 kids (any hockey players waive to Saint Anthony or Irondale)
Minneapolis North Community H.S. (Enr. 126) - 0 kids
Minneapolis Patrick Henry H. S. (Enr. 697) - 0 kids
Minneapolis Roosevelt High School (Enr. 527) - 1 kid
Minneapolis South High School (Enr. 1409) - 2 kids
Minneapolis Southwest High School (HOST) (Enr. 1428) - 15 kids
Minneapolis Washburn High School (Enr. 999) - 15 kids

Our teams have performed at the bottom of AA teams over the last decade as a result. I would not expect a state tourney run out of them this year at Class A (with that said, I believe they will be pretty strong 3-4 years from now and into the future after that).

[Bulldog3489]

Two schools are over 90% free and reduced lunch kids, two more are over 85%, and the three smaller schools probably average about 45 to 50% free and reduced lunch.

You really want them to play AA in hockey?

[gitter]

So do they have a Jr. Gold team? Those numbers are just impossible to fathom with that kind of enrollment (not a single kid from some of those schools plays hockey). Sad state for Minneapolis.

[gitter]

Two schools are over 90% free and reduced lunch kids, two more are over 85%, and the three smaller schools probably average about 45 to 50% free and reduced lunch.

You really want them to play AA in hockey?

You don't need to get sarcastic, I understand hockey has a much larger monetary commitment than other sports but that isn't the whole argument. I'm sure the stats are very similar in St Paul public schools (free and reduced), yet you don't see South, North, Como, Johnson and Henry Sibley (is that even a St. Paul school?) joining forces in class A. Providence Academy probably has a 0% free and reduced student body and Minneapolis will probably crush them in hockey.

Edit: Last year Minneapolis beat Moose Lake 17-0, Pine City 12-2, Becker 13-1, North Branch 13-0, and plenty more. So we can stop with the "Woe is Minneapolis" after clobbering a bunch of class A schools. I'm sure all those kids' parents are rich in those communities.

[InYourFace09]

Two schools are over 90% free and reduced lunch kids, two more are over 85%, and the three smaller schools probably average about 45 to 50% free and reduced lunch.

You really want them to play AA in hockey?

You don't need to get sarcastic, I understand hockey has a much larger monetary commitment than other sports but that isn't the whole argument. I'm sure the stats are very similar in St Paul public schools (free and reduced), yet you don't see South, North, Como, Johnson and Henry Sibley (is that even a St. Paul school?) joining forces in class A. Providence Academy probably has a 0% free and reduced student body and Minneapolis will probably crush them in hockey.

Pretty sure St Paul Harding has co-oped with Johnson or Como I believe, couple years ago. Hockey takes its toll on these cities and they combine. Whats wrong with them playing A?

[MNHockeyFan]

I'm sure the stats are very similar in St Paul public schools (free and reduced), yet you don't see South, North, Como, Johnson and Henry Sibley (is that even a St. Paul school?) joining forces in class A.

No, Henry Sibley is located in Mendota Heights and is in School District 197.

[gitter]

I'm sure the stats are very similar in St Paul public schools (free and reduced), yet you don't see South, North, Como, Johnson and Henry Sibley (is that even a St. Paul school?) joining forces in class A.

No, Henry Sibley is located in Mendota Heights and is in School District 197.

Thanks - my parents had some friends that lived in West St. Paul and I thought, for some reason, their kids went to Henry Sibley.

[InYourFace09]

I'm sure the stats are very similar in St Paul public schools (free and reduced), yet you don't see South, North, Como, Johnson and Henry Sibley (is that even a St. Paul school?) joining forces in class A.

No, Henry Sibley is located in Mendota Heights and is in School District 197.

Thanks - my parents had some friends that lived in West St. Paul and I thought, for some reason, their kids went to Henry Sibley.

That would be correct, if you live in West St Paul, you would go to Henry Sibley.

[gitter]

No, Henry Sibley is located in Mendota Heights and is in School District 197.

Thanks - my parents had some friends that lived in West St. Paul and I thought, for some reason, their kids went to Henry Sibley.

That would be correct, if you live in West St Paul, you would go to Henry Sibley.

Is that the same for kids from Mendota Heights then (assuming they aren't paying to go to STA)?

[InYourFace09]

Thanks - my parents had some friends that lived in West St. Paul and I thought, for some reason, their kids went to Henry Sibley.

That would be correct, if you live in West St Paul, you would go to Henry Sibley.

Is that the same for kids from Mendota Heights then (assuming they aren't paying to go to STA)?

Correct, that would be the public school they would attend. Henry Sibley is part of district 197 which includes all or parts of the communities of Eagan, Inver Grove Heights, Lilydale, Mendota, Mendota Heights, Sunfish Lake and West St. Paul

[MNHockeyFan]

Correct, that would be the public school they would attend. Henry Sibley is part of district 197 which includes all or parts of the communities of Eagan, Inver Grove Heights, Lilydale, Mendota, Mendota Heights, Sunfish Lake and West St. Paul

The school actually used to be located in West St. Paul, on Butler Avenue, until they build the "new" one, in the early 70's I believe.

[Roy01]

Enrollment wise, the team should be considered AA. But, with an inner city team like Minneapolis, other things need to take consideration (i.e. program funding, finances of families, etc.)

My eldest brother played for Minneapolis Edison in the mid-late 90's and even at that time program funding was not there. Collectively between these schools, and just the demographic within inner city schools, they aren't high income families. And there's nothing wrong with that, just with hockey it is sport that costs a bit more money.

Most of the families within the city that can afford to have their child play hockey will pay for them to play elsewhere (primarily private schools) because it provides them the best opportunity to play competitively, along with other factors such as exposure, etc. Imagine if all the players within the city stayed with the Minneapolis team, or even 80% of them. It'd be a hell of a group of skaters, just if these kids have the option to play at a private they will take it being as it, presently, provides the most opportunity.

On the city's end of things, as mentioned prior funding is not there coupled with arena closures (Northeast Ice Arena, former home of the Edison Tommies) and it makes things difficult as well. I still go skate up at Victory Memorial Ice Arena and sometimes there will be five of the Novas out there skating as well.

Accessibility to resources, that including ice, equipment, etc., will help rebuild the Minneapolis programs. Until something can be done to make hockey a possibility for more inner city student (mainly, making it financially possible for these kids) it will probably stay where it is for some time.

[InYourFace09]

Correct, that would be the public school they would attend. Henry Sibley is part of district 197 which includes all or parts of the communities of Eagan, Inver Grove Heights, Lilydale, Mendota, Mendota Heights, Sunfish Lake and West St. Paul

The school actually used to be located in West St. Paul, on Butler Avenue, until they build the "new" one, in the early 70's I believe.

The school is currently located in West St Paul on Delaware Ave.

[penguinos]

Its great to see Minneapolis youth teams doing well for the first time in years...it really depends on how many of those kids are in the public system and if they stay there or not when they get to high school. As for being A instead of AA I'd say its fair based on the number of kids playing hockey, although I realize thats not the traditional way to deciding that.

In Saint Paul, Harding is not combined with Johnson. There are three high school teams: Johnson, Como (co-op with Central) and Highland. (responding to the previous post... South St. Paul, North St. Paul and Sibley are not in Saint Paul, different school districts...)

All three Saint Paul teams are doing relatively poorly beating only bottom feeder teams, with Johnson being the best, Highland with weakest. Highland is only varsity, Como and Johnson both have JV and Varsity teams. All three schools combined have about 75 high school players (no cuts). In Saint Paul there are four youth associations with Highland being the only one currently fielding A level teams. Johnson Como field B teams, and Edgecumbe and Langford field only C level teams. Most of the top youth players end up at Cretin, Saint Paul Academy, St. Thomas, or Minneahaha, so the pool of talented skaters really thins at the publics in Saint Paul. Johnson and Como were considering combing at the high school level a few years back but did not end up doing it. I think Saint Paul really needs to think about a long term plan to get back to competitive hockey, a la Minneapolis.

Minneapolis, Johnson and Como all play in the Tri Metro this year which is basically dissolving for hockey next year with the privates leaving that conference. Does anyone know what conference these three teams will play in next year?

[InYourFace09]

Its great to see Minneapolis youth teams doing well for the first time in years...it really depends on how many of those kids are in the public system and if they stay there or not when they get to high school. As for being A instead of AA I'd say its fair based on the number of kids playing hockey, although I realize thats not the traditional way to deciding that.

In Saint Paul, Harding is not combined with Johnson. There are three high school teams: Johnson, Como (co-op with Central) and Highland. (responding to the previous post... South St. Paul, North St. Paul and Sibley are not in Saint Paul, different school districts...)

All three Saint Paul teams are doing relatively poorly beating only bottom feeder teams, with Johnson being the best, Highland with weakest. Highland is only varsity, Como and Johnson both have JV and Varsity teams. All three schools combined have about 75 high school players (no cuts). In Saint Paul there are four youth associations with Highland being the only one currently fielding A level teams. Johnson Como field B teams, and Edgecumbe and Langford field only C level teams. Most of the top youth players end up at Cretin, Saint Paul Academy, St. Thomas, or Minneahaha, so the pool of talented skaters really thins at the publics in Saint Paul. Johnson and Como were considering combing at the high school level a few years back but did not end up doing it. I think Saint Paul really needs to think about a long term plan to get back to competitive hockey, a la Minneapolis.

Minneapolis, Johnson and Como all play in the Tri Metro this year which is basically dissolving for hockey next year with the privates leaving that conference. Does anyone know what conference these three teams will play in next year?

Where do Harding kids play hockey?

[penguinos]

I didn't say Highland played in the Tri Metro.

There are no hockey players at Harding.

The few hockey kids that live in that area are attending Johnson.

[InYourFace09]

I didn't say Highland played in the Tri Metro.

There are no hockey players at Harding.

The few hockey kids that live in that area are attending Johnson.

Ya I read your previous post too fast and deleted the conference question.

I now remember correctly that Johnson and Como were going to get together but that never happened. So with Harding being the largest St Paul school and having 0 hockey players, how is it hard to believe that all of the Mpls schools don't have the participation?

Looks like it is the same for both cities.

[Bulldog3489]

Two schools are over 90% free and reduced lunch kids, two more are over 85%, and the three smaller schools probably average about 45 to 50% free and reduced lunch.

You really want them to play AA in hockey?

You don't need to get sarcastic, I understand hockey has a much larger monetary commitment than other sports but that isn't the whole argument. I'm sure the stats are very similar in St Paul public schools (free and reduced), yet you don't see South, North, Como, Johnson and Henry Sibley (is that even a St. Paul school?) joining forces in class A. Providence Academy probably has a 0% free and reduced student body and Minneapolis will probably crush them in hockey.

All the St. Paul city schools are now combined on the girls side (Central, Como, Harding, Highland Park and Johnson) and recently moved down from AA to class A. Not sure if the boys will get there or not.

[HShockeywatcher]

It's about darn time they are in Class A. Putting cooped teams in AA basically defeats the whole (well, part of) idea behind behind cooping, especially when many of the schools don't actually contribute to the coop.

Two schools are over 90% free and reduced lunch kids, two more are over 85%, and the three smaller schools probably average about 45 to 50% free and reduced lunch.

You really want them to play AA in hockey?

You don't need to get sarcastic, I understand hockey has a much larger monetary commitment than other sports but that isn't the whole argument. I'm sure the stats are very similar in St Paul public schools (free and reduced), yet you don't see South, North, Como, Johnson and Henry Sibley (is that even a St. Paul school?) joining forces in class A. Providence Academy probably has a 0% free and reduced student body and Minneapolis will probably crush them in hockey.

Edit: Last year Minneapolis beat Moose Lake 17-0, Pine City 12-2, Becker 13-1, North Branch 13-0, and plenty more. So we can stop with the "Woe is Minneapolis" after clobbering a bunch of class A schools. I'm sure all those kids' parents are rich in those communities.

So they beat some bad school handily, what's your point?
I don't see many people saying "Woe is Minneapolis," I see more people "a team that has to combine all 7 (4 really) high schools to draw less than 35 kids from the largest city in the state to field a team shouldn't be playing in AA."

[SWPrez]

Accessibility to resources, that including ice, equipment, etc., will help rebuild the Minneapolis programs. Until something can be done to make hockey a possibility for more inner city student (mainly, making it financially possible for these kids) it will probably stay where it is for some time.

Minneapolis is down right now, but should do fine in the near future. In 2004, we began aggressively marketing hockey to public school kids. Because Southwest and Washburn were competing associations, our marketing to public schools was difficult. Very few kids were public with most being Catholic schools.

In 2008, Washburn and Southwest merged and marketing to public schools became much easier. Today, over half of our players (400+) are public school kids.

You are beginning to see the results of these efforts at the youth levels (Peewee A state champ last year, this year many of our teams are rated top 10). While many of these kids will go to private - many of them will stay public. Watch for Minneapolis to become very strong in 3-4 years as recruiting efforts that began a decade ago begin feeding the high school program.

[green4]

Accessibility to resources, that including ice, equipment, etc., will help rebuild the Minneapolis programs. Until something can be done to make hockey a possibility for more inner city student (mainly, making it financially possible for these kids) it will probably stay where it is for some time.

Minneapolis is down right now, but should do fine in the near future. In 2004, we began aggressively marketing hockey to public school kids. Because Southwest and Washburn were competing associations, our marketing to public schools was difficult. Very few kids were public with most being Catholic schools.

In 2008, Washburn and Southwest merged and marketing to public schools became much easier. Today, over half of our players (400+) are public school kids.

You are beginning to see the results of these efforts at the youth levels (Peewee A state champ last year, this year many of our teams are rated top 10). While many of these kids will go to private - many of them will stay public. Watch for Minneapolis to become very strong in 3-4 years as recruiting efforts that began a decade ago begin feeding the high school program.

This is interesting to me, what is the plan then when Minneapolis does become good? Once good players start playing for the city more and more will they Opt back up to AA? will they expand back out into east and west? That last part to me is the most interesting. With only one team for the whole city and with rising numbers of kids wanting to play for Minneapolis it will become very competitive and depending on how far in the future if they do continue to have more and more kids play they will eventually have to expand.

[HShockeywatcher]

This is interesting to me, what is the plan then when Minneapolis does become good? Once good players start playing for the city more and more will they Opt back up to AA? will they expand back out into east and west? That last part to me is the most interesting. With only one team for the whole city and with rising numbers of kids wanting to play for Minneapolis it will become very competitive and depending on how far in the future if they do continue to have more and more kids play they will eventually have to expand.

Seems pretty simple to me.
In a perfect world, more kids stay in the mpls program, less leave for private schools, they become more competitive and schools part off their own ways. With F/R as they are, only South/Southwest would be AA schools and all could likely petition down until either of those schools is on their own.

Really, what's the issue? Right now we have private schools dominating Class A. Who would complain if Minneapolis made it to state or won a title? Would anyone, really? It would be a breath of fresh air to EVERYONE.

[green4]

This is interesting to me, what is the plan then when Minneapolis does become good? Once good players start playing for the city more and more will they Opt back up to AA? will they expand back out into east and west? That last part to me is the most interesting. With only one team for the whole city and with rising numbers of kids wanting to play for Minneapolis it will become very competitive and depending on how far in the future if they do continue to have more and more kids play they will eventually have to expand.

Seems pretty simple to me.
In a perfect world, more kids stay in the mpls program, less leave for private schools, they become more competitive and schools part off their own ways. With F/R as they are, only South/Southwest would be AA schools and all could likely petition down until either of those schools is on their own.

Really, what's the issue? Right now we have private schools dominating Class A. Who would complain if Minneapolis made it to state or won a title? Would anyone, really? It would be a breath of fresh air to EVERYONE.

Yes but this is not a perfect world, kids are going to leave for private schools. I don't see it being that simple. I don't see Minneapolis bringing back teams for each school and I don't see them getting more than 2 teams for the city unless something extremely drastic changes. But I think eventually if all is going to how it seems it will pan out then they will have to have two teams I believe and at that point Im not sure its worth opting up to AA. I think with one team they will have the talent to compete in AA but if they split into two teams Im unsure.

[Night Train]

Watch for Minneapolis to become very strong in 3-4 years as recruiting efforts that began a decade ago begin feeding the high school program.

Thanks SWPrez! The best hockey association President ever. I read the other post that mentioned you've grown the youth association from 150 to over 700 in the last 10 years. At one time zero girls teams and now growth on the girls side too with 9 girls teams. Keep up your good work!