How to make the single A tournament more interesting

Williamsephs · Post by **Williamsephs** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 11:00 pm

So Breck won 10-1 and South Saint Paul won 6-1 in the first two games today. No surprise, and on Friday Breck will probably roll over South Saint Paul en route to their second state championship in recent years. The question is, how do we fix it and make the state tournament a representation of the best teams? One solution would be split up section 5a, which has been intentionally manufactured into the toughest section in the state (Breck, Blake, Benilde, Mahtomedi, Saint Louis Park, and Totino Grace) for the sole reason of keeping the private school's from dominating the state tournament (which punishes St. Louis Park and Totino Grace as well). I mean think about it, the winner of that section has won 4 of the last 5 state tournaments, and all 6 of those teams were in the top ten at some point this season. They'd probably win all the State Tournaments if they didn't have to beat eachother up just to qualify. The funny thing is that section 5a makes no sense geographically either. Mahtomedi is in St. Paul! So why don't we split it up, put Benilde in Orono's section (they play in the same conference), put Totino-Grace and Mahtomedi back in a St. Paul section where they belong , and let Breck, Blake, and St. Louis Park slug it out in section 5a. At least that way we'll ensure there are 4 good teams in the tournament; Orono/Benilde, Blake/Breck/St.Louis Park, Mahtomedi/Totino, Warroad. That way we'll have better quarterfinal games, great semi-final games, and an awesome championship that will hopefully represent the best two teams in the state. This year was a disgrace, as the best teams in the state eliminated eachother in section 5a culminating in a final that pitted Breck 25-1-2 against Blake 23-3-2 in what I foresee as the closest game that Breck plays in the postseason. Sorry if this sounds despressing, but I just hate to watch teams play in the state tournament that wouldn't have even gotten a top 6 seed in section 5a. Orono probably wouldn't have even been in the top 6 yet they're most likely Breck's toughest remaining competition.

MNPuckster27 · Post by **MNPuckster27** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 11:08 pm

Although I do like parts of your post.... 1A and 4A would still be terrible, and those are the ones that need to be stronger... Moving Benilde, Mahtomedi, and Totino out would make for more interesting sectional play though so I like that... Oh and I doubt Breck will "roll" over SSP on friday and IF they do they wont "roll" over anyone in the finals... I think we will see all good games the rest of the way in class A, with the exeption being the consolation finals with Warroad pounding someone (if they still care enough to play hard).

upucker · Post by **upucker** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 11:35 pm

I hear Shattuck will be suiting up a eligible High School team next year and will be in 1A should help that section possible even take state title.

blueliner10 · Post by **blueliner10** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 11:41 pm

Those damn private schools sould have their own state tournament, they have some of the best talent from all over and they say they don't recruit but we all know they do

Williamsephs · Post by **Williamsephs** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 11:42 pm

If what you say is true that would definitely be a welcome addition to the state tournament. I still think it would be a unfair to keep section 5a the way it is though. If Orono, Shattuck, and Lourdes get to make the tournament almost every year with no competition how can you rationalize Blake, Breck, Totino, Benilde, St.Louid Park, and Mahtomedi playing for one berth into the State tournament? I've seen Blake and Breck play eachother and I have to say that I haven't seen any teams tonight that look even close to what either of those two teams are capable of. I just hope someone gives Breck a good game although I don't think it'll happen. Oh and by the way I meant to say that Mahtomedi and St.Louis Park get screwed by the Minnesota State High School hockey league trying to keep private school's from dominating the state tournament (as Blake, Breck, Benilde, and Totino are all private).

Williamsephs · Post by **Williamsephs** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 11:47 pm

Watching Blake, Breck, Totino, Benilde, Lourdes, Holy Angels, Cretin Duram Hall, and Hill Murray would definitely be an interesting tournament. As far as recruiting goes I don't really know what you can say. What would you do if you had the opportunity to go to a school that offered you a better chance to get into a good college and a better chance to get noticed by scouts, not to mention a parents' perogative to give their children the best possible opportunity?

upucker · Post by **upucker** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 12:42 am

I say if you have to buy your way into the tournament by going to a private school what honor and pride do you have. And isn't it kind of a cheap feeling you left your friends high and dry at your old high school. Actually your saying to your old friends "its been nice to know ya but you guys are not worth a dam so I have to go get noticed somewhere else."

ramsfan · Post by **ramsfan** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 1:09 am

one thing you people must understand is that this has been a problem for many years....and it will never be fixed. a look back at state tourneys their has always been bad games. ALWAYS! High school sports does not trade players or have free agents like pro sports, so their is never gonna be a balance of talent. Can we make sections based on talent? absolutely not! Maybe we should make 7 sections in the metro area and have one outstate team. This would make room for every "great team" in the state. Right! HAHA From Roseau to St. Cloud: 275 miles. That means city teams could play half way through Iowa and be in their section. Remember when Elk River was part of Section 8. It seems that people are forgetting about the great north. And yes, Some of the greatest games in the tourney have come from up in the sticks. YES, i do agree that some things in the mshsl are screwed up,but, You can't switch the sections based on talent every year,that would be terrible for rivalries. And the comment about the ranking the teams and having a 2 weekend tourney is the most idiotic idea i have heard EVER. What would you do without a duluth east/grand rapis rivalry. and much more of the same rivalries. Let's use our heads!!!

verb1999 · Post by **verb1999** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 9:53 am

I propose celebrity boxing between periods.

cyozzie36 · Post by **cyozzie36** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 1:02 pm

I know its been said but still Private school should be forced to play double aa. Sooner or later they will get the picture. With the availability of players they should step up and go play with the big boys. Hill has been doing it for years and thats they way it should be. Quit beating up on the teams that you have a competitive advantage over. I wouldn't mindeseeing the Double AA starting on Wednesday and having the Single A on Thursday. That way the big boys get a day or rest before the semis. More people would be in the Twin Cities so the Class A games may get more of a crowd. Also, maybe just Class A or both should reseed for the Tourney. Get the coaches together and seed the teams 1-8 promote the best teams at the tourney hopefully advancing the farthest. Just a thought. Don't really think this is needed in Double A but in Class A it may build the anticipation to the finals. Another idea: What about professional cheerleaders at the games. Bring in the wolves girls if they have them or something of that nature. Later

slphockey · Post by **slphockey** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 2:16 pm

The Class A tournament is interesting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

dandunnigan3 · Post by **dandunnigan3** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 9:48 pm

Williamsephs i agree with your post, i was mahtomedis manager and it made no sense for us to play in minneapolis when we live in east st. paul. the bus ride to alrich was 5 minutes where we played last year in sections, while the ride to parade was 45 minutes.

GR80 · Post by **GR80** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 10:50 am

My solution to this problem would be to split up those 5A private schools to different sections. It is a crying shame that the top ranked teams did not make it to state. It obvioiusly would make a better state tourney. But the second have of my soultion would be to make all the private schools play AA hockey. Have the guts to play up like Holy Angels and Hill Murray. The private schools have shown they can compete with the AA schools becasue they play them during the season. If they want to win state championships then put your money where your mouth is and step up to the plate.

scheids316 · Post by **scheids316** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 10:56 am

dan...Complaining about a 45 minute bus ride? Now I've heard it all. Scheids (A legend in his girlfriend's mind.)

longlaker · Post by **longlaker** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 11:47 am

i don't want any changes to the class a tourney. i think it's fine as it is. there's weak sections in class aa too. things are great already, and today w/the semis they're even getting better.

oldschool · Post by **oldschool** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:09 pm

Look, this problem is simple, all of you are thinking way too hard. A couple years ago class a WAS good. Every section had its powers (some had more than others) but the state tourney turned out pretty darn good. My question is: why fix something that is not broken MSHSL!!!!!! Come on. You want to see good quality state tourney games, you want to see great section rivalrys you want to see a more balanced field then put it back the way it was. IT has been stated on here that 4 and 1 are the worst, I agree VERY much. Does anyone realize that in the past 10 years section 4a has been home to: St. CLoud Cathedral (changed probably because of geography thats fine but 2 wasn't hurting), Saud Rapids, same thing as Cathedral but 2 didn't need any more teams, and the long hated rival of Fergus, Wadena, and LF Detroit Lakes wich is the biggest farsk of them all, (section 8 was probably not competitive enough<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... /laugh.gif ALT=":lol"> ). Now it was Fergus Wadena Willmar and LF. give me a break. Section one is the REAL farsk however in the fact that at the beginning of the season they had NO state tournement teams in the section. Not a team had EVER whent to state. Sure, only Red Wing and Lourdes were there before but they always did good. so don't look deeper than the one's who put the thing on, the mshsl, if they want to keep on having lop sided scores and poor attendance, let them...........untill they fix it, god help class a.........

Davesamess · Post by **Davesamess** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:52 pm

Play it on rollerblades.

Huckleberry · Post by **Huckleberry** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 1:17 pm

An idea like this was kicked around before they dumped the 2 Tier tourny, but maybe it would have some merit to keep schools in their proper class, thus making the A tournament more competitive. Starting with the current class system, move any "A" teams up to "AA" that have done the following: - Won 2 titles in the past 6 years. - Appeared in the championship game 3 times in a 6 year span. - Been in the State tournament 4 times in a 5 year period. Move teams from "AA" down to "A" that have done the following: - Go thru a 6 year period without advancing to section semi-finals. - Go thru a 12 year period without advancing to a section final. I know this would take some tweeking, and I don't know how many teams would actually have to move one way or another, but it's something to think about.

dandunnigan3 · Post by **dandunnigan3** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 2:25 pm

scheids316 lets be honest, you have no girlfriend

oldschool · Post by **oldschool** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 5:15 pm

hey huck, gotta second??listen: I've NEVER seen this sort of thing before, you talk about the two tier tourney that unbelievably failed then try to make another one. Why take all of the talent out of hockey?? so that we can have a tourney that Wadena and ALbert LEa dominate?????? that isn't fun, you go to a hockey game to see skills of players from around minnesota, and their team. Competitive or not, current system is good as long as they can balance the sections a little better.........by the way, knowing sheidz, he's one heckuva pimp...............good try though........

HighSchoolHockeyForums.com

How to make the single A tournament more interesting

How to make the single A tournament more interesting

Sections...

sections

Re: sections

That'd be nice

Private School's with their own tournament?

cheapens the experience

never gonna fix it!

Re: never gonna fix it!

Class A

????????

good post

Class A Tourney

Re: Class A Tourney

a tourney is fine

class a

single A

Class A

scheids316

class a