Team Minnesota...Minnesota vs. Michigan series

[High Flyer]

I'm very familar with the Mich. team and players.

[Hockeyguy_27]

high flyer

how do you know if the kids haven't been playing together since squirts because as you have stated you weren't even there.

High Flyer, time to change the bong water

[hockey34721]

how are you famaliar with them if you live in minnesota as i am assuming.

[High Flyer]

hockey34721, how I'm familar with them or where I live is not the issue.

What is the issue is that we are still wating for buckeyehockey17 and Jancze5 to back up thier statements (as I've challenged the validity), yet we still are waiting for them to back up thier claims with some facts.

Where are you?????

how are you famaliar with them if you live in minnesota as i am assuming.

[FromDetroit]

I thought that I would offer a few Detroit perspectives.

First of all the organizers were telling the Detroit 93’s that they are going to lose big time to the teams from MN. Fact.

This event was very over hyped and did not deliver. Fact.

I can’t see how these Detroit kids would be willing to travel to MN next season after the fiasco in Detroit.

This is how the games with the 93’s went down:

Originally each MI team was to play two games against each of the MN teams. First two games against LC and Team Mich were complete blow outs, so the organizers changed the format and the third game was MN1 vs. MN2 and Mich vs. LC. The last (forth) game had some of the 92’s playing for the 93/94 MN team to make it closer, without any significant impact.

I will leave it to you all to discuss if in fact the top talent attended, all I can tell you is that the LC team that played was the same team that played the entire spring. With the exception of a few kids that were ultimately cut from LC and one kid who decided not to play for LC, the team will remain intact for the fall. Fact.

hockey34721 wrote “the 93 little ceasars team has been playing together for 5 years and their team did not have kids from michigan. they had about 6 kids from michigan. they also had kids from california, ohio, florida, and new york. the michigan coordinator did not do a very good job because in the 93/94 level one of the teams was the 93 little ceasars and that is not fair. they could have at least split them up. the minnesota teams didn't make a team for just the cities area.”

There are only 4 or 5 players that played with this team 2 seasons ago. Fact.

Only one out-of-state player played for LC that was not playing in the league in the past season. He played with the team the entire spring and was considering moving to MI. I am not certain if he will be on the LC team this fall season. Fact.

The other players that were born outside of MI have been either playing with this club, or another club in the league in the prior season. Fact.

CA kid will be with the club for his third season and is living in Detroit with his immediate family. LC only has 2 kids on the team from Ohio, and both will be playing their second fall season with this team. Many Ohio kids have been playing for the Detroit teams for years, as they live only about 1 hour from the Detroit rink. Most people do not even look at them as out of state. No one from NY was on the LC team. Fact.

Hope this helps, but most importantly get you FACTS correct before posting.

[High Flyer]

FromDetroit

Thanks for clarifying this, as it appears you are a Mich. insider who actually knows the facts, which has been by the point I have been trying to make with my MN counter parts.

I also must appoligize for my MN parents who keep posting "excuses" on this web site as to why MN got beat so badly. I hope that the lesson learned by the organiziers of this event (on both sides) is to make sure you get your best players to compete in this event. I also agree with you as too your statement as to why would a group of players from Mich come to Minesota next year after this years experience.

I thought that I would offer a few Detroit perspectives.

First of all the organizers were telling the Detroit 93’s that they are going to lose big time to the teams from MN. Fact.

This event was very over hyped and did not deliver. Fact.

I can’t see how these Detroit kids would be willing to travel to MN next season after the fiasco in Detroit.

This is how the games with the 93’s went down:

Originally each MI team was to play two games against each of the MN teams. First two games against LC and Team Mich were complete blow outs, so the organizers changed the format and the third game was MN1 vs. MN2 and Mich vs. LC. The last (forth) game had some of the 92’s playing for the 93/94 MN team to make it closer, without any significant impact.

I will leave it to you all to discuss if in fact the top talent attended, all I can tell you is that the LC team that played was the same team that played the entire spring. With the exception of a few kids that were ultimately cut from LC and one kid who decided not to play for LC, the team will remain intact for the fall. Fact.

hockey34721 wrote “the 93 little ceasars team has been playing together for 5 years and their team did not have kids from michigan. they had about 6 kids from michigan. they also had kids from california, ohio, florida, and new york. the michigan coordinator did not do a very good job because in the 93/94 level one of the teams was the 93 little ceasars and that is not fair. they could have at least split them up. the minnesota teams didn't make a team for just the cities area.”

There are only 4 or 5 players that played with this team 2 seasons ago. Fact.

Only one out-of-state player played for LC that was not playing in the league in the past season. He played with the team the entire spring and was considering moving to MI. I am not certain if he will be on the LC team this fall season. Fact.

The other players that were born outside of MI have been either playing with this club, or another club in the league in the prior season. Fact.

CA kid will be with the club for his third season and is living in Detroit with his immediate family. LC only has 2 kids on the team from Ohio, and both will be playing their second fall season with this team. Many Ohio kids have been playing for the Detroit teams for years, as they live only about 1 hour from the Detroit rink. Most people do not even look at them as out of state. No one from NY was on the LC team. Fact.

Hope this helps, but most importantly get you FACTS correct before posting.

[FromDetroit]

High Flyer,

I just came on to let you know that the MN boys were not playing against some super-duper-ultra-recruited teams. The MI team (comprised of Honey Baked and Compuware) and LC team have top talent and both LC and Comp are ranked highly in the US, so the outcome of the weekend is not a huge surprise. However I did not want someone to propagate some wild and crazy idea that either of these teams scoured for talent from all over the world just so they can beat up on MN teams. No need to apologize for the posters, we have our share in Detroit, and they tend to be the “baggage” of all competitive sports. They are kind of funny actually.

MN has and always will have top notch kids and excellent coaching. I do not know your talent pool, but I would assume it is as great, if not greater than MI’s. Picking the right kids and coaching them is also a factor, but that is why the kids play the games.

Looking at the LC’s calendar, it appears that they will be playing MN team or teams in August in Ann Arbor. Have no ideas as to what the make-up of the MN teams will be at that time, or what the outcome of these games will be. I will assume that LC will be bringing their fall team. Perhaps some of the MN parents attending the event will fill us in without the elaborate stories about the “recruited” team.

Wishing all of you a great summer,
FromDetroit

[High Flyer]

The group that is comming up in August from MN should consist of a better MN talent pool, though it sounds like they are bring up two teams, so it's unclear as to how many "holes" they will have. Tryouts are this weekend in Bloomington, with 80 skaters signed up so far. I've seen the list of particapants and can tell you that there will be at least 15-20 of MN top kids comming up to Michigan in August, compared to the 4 to 5 that went earlyer this year.

High Flyer,

I just came on to let you know that the MN boys were not playing against some super-duper-ultra-recruited teams. The MI team (comprised of Honey Baked and Compuware) and LC team have top talent and both LC and Comp are ranked highly in the US, so the outcome of the weekend is not a huge surprise. However I did not want someone to propagate some wild and crazy idea that either of these teams scoured for talent from all over the world just so they can beat up on MN teams. No need to apologize for the posters, we have our share in Detroit, and they tend to be the “baggage” of all competitive sports. They are kind of funny actually.

MN has and always will have top notch kids and excellent coaching. I do not know your talent pool, but I would assume it is as great, if not greater than MI’s. Picking the right kids and coaching them is also a factor, but that is why the kids play the games.

Looking at the LC’s calendar, it appears that they will be playing MN team or teams in August in Ann Arbor. Have no ideas as to what the make-up of the MN teams will be at that time, or what the outcome of these games will be. I will assume that LC will be bringing their fall team. Perhaps some of the MN parents attending the event will fill us in without the elaborate stories about the “recruited” team.

Wishing all of you a great summer,
FromDetroit

[PlayersFirst]

FromDetroit Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 5:42 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I thought that I would offer a few Detroit perspectives.

First of all the organizers were telling the Detroit 93’s that they are going to lose big time to the teams from MN. Fact.

This event was very over hyped and did not deliver. Fact.

I can’t see how these Detroit kids would be willing to travel to MN next season after the fiasco in Detroit.

This is how the games with the 93’s went down:

Originally each MI team was to play two games against each of the MN teams. First two games against LC and Team Mich were complete blow outs, so the organizers changed the format and the third game was MN1 vs. MN2 and Mich vs. LC. The last (forth) game had some of the 92’s playing for the 93/94 MN team to make it closer, without any significant impact.

I will leave it to you all to discuss if in fact the top talent attended, all I can tell you is that the LC team that played was the same team that played the entire spring. With the exception of a few kids that were ultimately cut from LC and one kid who decided not to play for LC, the team will remain intact for the fall. Fact.

hockey34721 wrote “the 93 little ceasars team has been playing together for 5 years and their team did not have kids from michigan. they had about 6 kids from michigan. they also had kids from california, ohio, florida, and new york. the michigan coordinator did not do a very good job because in the 93/94 level one of the teams was the 93 little ceasars and that is not fair. they could have at least split them up. the minnesota teams didn't make a team for just the cities area.”

There are only 4 or 5 players that played with this team 2 seasons ago. Fact.

Only one out-of-state player played for LC that was not playing in the league in the past season. He played with the team the entire spring and was considering moving to MI. I am not certain if he will be on the LC team this fall season. Fact.

The other players that were born outside of MI have been either playing with this club, or another club in the league in the prior season. Fact.

CA kid will be with the club for his third season and is living in Detroit with his immediate family. LC only has 2 kids on the team from Ohio, and both will be playing their second fall season with this team. Many Ohio kids have been playing for the Detroit teams for years, as they live only about 1 hour from the Detroit rink. Most people do not even look at them as out of state. No one from NY was on the LC team. Fact.

Hope this helps, but most importantly get you FACTS correct before posting.

Fromdetroit. Thanks for your comments. Here are some additional comments:

FACT. The MN vs. MI event was originally set up for the 1989,1990 and 1991 levels. The 1993 teams were only added to this series at the request of Little Caesars. The 93's were NEVER a focus of the MN organizers.

FACT. Everyone seems to focus on the 1993's when the series was really for the 89, 90 & 91's.


FACT. It is true that the Detroit promoters of the series were telling everyone that MN was going to smoke MI at the 93 level. This was pure hype that was unappreciated, as the MN organizers never held that opinion. This was a fabricated comment by the Detroit organizers and it was not fair to the Detroit participants.

NOT A FACT: This event was over-hyped at the 1993 level, but it delivered a ton - especially at the older levels where the competition was remarkable on both sides. Stop focusing on the 1993's.

FACT: After the 1993 fiasco, the Detroit kids may not make the trip to Minneapolis? This could be the case, but it has been communicated that the 1993 group will probably not be included next year anyway. It appears as though the MN organizers will focus on 89,90,91 and maybe 1992's for next years event in Minneapolis to keep it a high school showcase.

I have also heard that Minnesota is bringing in three teams from Canada, one team from New England and one team from Illinois. If Michigan doesn't want to visit Minneapolis, that is really too bad as they are welcome to join. I do know that no formal organizations, such as Little Caesars or Belle Tire, will be able to field a team as an org. Teams will be area teams like Team Minnesota, Team New England, etc.

I hope that helps from the MN perspective. The MN 1993's were really dominated by the MI 1993's, but it was a great learning lesson for the MN players. Indeed, the MN 1993's did not have the best that Minnesota can offer and that was too bad.

The 1989, 1990 and 1991's really dominated the MI teams though, as they went 6 wins, 1 loss and 1 tie. It is funny to hear MI parents/players stating that they may not come back to Minneapolis because of the 1993 debockle. I have not heard of any 89-91 Minnesota players stating that they will not play against the Michigan players again in Minneapolis because they beat them so bad in Detroit...

[FromDetroit]

[
The 1989, 1990 and 1991's really dominated the MI teams though, as they went 6 wins, 1 loss and 1 tie. It is funny to hear MI parents/players stating that they may not come back to Minneapolis because of the 1993 debockle. I have not heard of any 89-91 Minnesota players stating that they will not play against the Michigan players again in Minneapolis because they beat them so bad in Detroit...

Player First,

I did not intend to upset you or anyone else, and was only responding to a number of posts which were primarily regarding the 93 birth year. However, since you brought it up, the 92’s and 91’s did not fare any better than the 93’s. The MN 92’s lost all of their games, and the 91’s won only one game in a shoot-out, which must leave 89’s and 90’s with the successful outings. Good for them! In fact, good for everyone that participated. The outcome does not relay the story, nor was it the focus of my original post.

Once again, sorry that I hurt your feelings, which is evident in your last sentence of your post. No need to take anything that I wrote personally. I am certain that if the MN kids beat MI kids in double digits they too would have similar sentiment.

Stay cool,
FromDetroit

[GoldenBear]

From Detroit. Thanks for your information and polite/professional dialect to this matter to help all of us "cut through" some of the other comments.

[GR3343]

Seriously, this discussion has gone on longer than a presidential debate. Let it go people. Mich. won handily at the '92 & '93 level. Minn won handily at the '89 '90 level. Who cares? It's summer hockey, and no one probably brought their A level teams. Turn the page already.

[High Flyer]

Agreed!!

Maybe someone could send a PM to playersfirst, so he stops his PR dribble for the event and stops posting his excuses. Everyone else has figured out why MN lost at the 93 level, even people from Detroit.

[PlayersFirst]

Agreed!!

Maybe someone could send a PM to playersfirst, so he stops his PR dribble for the event and stops posting his excuses. Everyone else has figured out why MN lost at the 93 level, even people from Detroit.

Well said - I couldn't agree more. I agree that this topic has gone on for too long. I apologize, but I take this a little at heart as I know all of the guys who put this thing together and they are rather genuine in their efforts.

I am not making an attempt to create any excuses for the event, but I am biased as I really liked the format and hope it continues and improves; it has many areas to improve.

It is kind of funny, though, that this series was back in May and it is still being debated in July. It is good to remember that it IS a summer event and it is supposed to provide a little fun within competition.

Take care - happy posting.

[FREDFLINTSTONE]

When are they going to find out who made the teams?

[FromDetroit]

I did not see any games, but although closer, MI won all 4 games vs. MN.

Ok, here are the scores (from people who attended the event), so they may not be 100% accurate.

MI Team 1 vs Minn Team 1 (4-2)
MI Team 2 vs Minn Team 2 (6-5)
MI Team 2 vs Minn Team 1 (9-5)
MI Team 1 vs Minn Team 2 (11-9)

Penalty shots were awarded for each penalty, resulting in higher scoring games.

[FromDetroit]

[hockey34721]

from detroit
you had all the games right until the last two. 8-5 not 9-5. 6-5 not 11-9. 11-9 was the score between the minnesota and michigan team. the minnesota was winnning 9-7 with 1:30 left in the last period but collapsed and let up 4 goals.

[FromDetroit]

from detroit
you had all the games right until the last two. 8-5 not 9-5. 6-5 not 11-9. 11-9 was the score between the minnesota and michigan team. the minnesota was winnning 9-7 with 1:30 left in the last period but collapsed and let up 4 goals.

I am sorry, but I am lost. I posted that the game score between MI and MN score was 11-9. What was the 6-5 score?

Also, if you were at any of the games, do you have any reflections or highlights?

[topshelf3]

The August Minnesota - Michigan hockey games were a very fun and competitive series. The MN "Premier 93" teams were selected by Bernie and the Minnesota Made crew. Very representative. Had most (but not all) of the 93 Minnesota top talent represented on two teams (20 on each team excluding goalies - selected from a tryout of 80 invitees). The final two teams (44 total including goalies) included top Bantam A players (and a few '93 PWA players) from The Wisconsin Fire, Edina, Chaska, Eden Prairie, Jefferson, Duluth, New Prague, Wayzata, Minnetonka, Champlain, Lakeville South, Burnsville, White Bear Lake, Eagan, etc. After watching all games here were the scores:

MN#1 vs. Mich #1: (4-2) (Mich)
MN#2 vs. Mich #2: (6-5) (Mich)
MN#1 vs. Mich #2 (8-5) (Mich)
MN#2 vs. Mich #1 (11-9) (Mich)

Since the goal of this event for the MN POV was for the kids to be introduced to the USA develpment team coaching staff and not to win at all costs against Michigan the games were played straight up and there was no mixing of teams or shorting the bench (the Michigan team did a little of and it was no big deal as they had a different objective than MN). From speaking with some of the MI parents their kids really enjoyed the competition. The Minnesota teams wanted Michigan's best and they got it. The MI kids were great hockey players. The MN kids practiced 2 hours together before playing the Michigan kids who play together during the year (although they mixed some of the pool of the 3-4 Michigan teams they drew from (Honey Baked, Little Caesars, Compuware) the Michigan parents told us they generally kept the lines together).

All four teams were excellent with few if any weak spots. VERY FUN HOCKEY TO WATCH. Very fast and technically pretty darn good. Bernie and Minnesota Made did a great job of identifying and bringing most of the best MN '93 talent. The Michigan kids were excellent hockey players who were very well conditioned and strong on their skates. They were definitely conditioned better than the MN kids and it showed in the corners and the battles. However, other than the conditioning edge and the fact that the MI kids played together anybody who watched this wouldn't bet their house any of the four teams winning in a real tournament among these four teams. It is interesting to note that the MNs teams tied or won the second half (two 30 minute stop time periods per game) of all games which clearly suggests they were pretty evenly matched and given equal practice, conditioning and goals (win instead of equal time for everyone who went from MN) these team would be 50/50 against each other in my humble opinion and in the opinion of many folks there.

The two MN teams also played each other twice and split the games (6-3, 6-2) which is a testament to how evenly matched MN Made balanced the teams.

There was one interesting rule change for these games which was fun. Since the goal for the MN teams was exposure to USA hockey all penalties resulted in a penalty shot but no 5-4 situations. That was a smart decision as it maximized the number of kids on the ice at all times and was a fun twist to the games that gave the goalies and the skaters added exposure.

Thanks to Bernie the kids and parents got a tour of the USA Development program's facilities and got to attend a Q and A with some of the coaches from the USA Development team. It was a great experience for the kids and all who attended.

A big hats off the the MI coaches and kids for providing a great experience for the MN kids. One of the best moments of the weekend was when a very big MI kid hit one of the smaller MN kids and he went down and had to be helped off the MI kid helped him off and clearly demonstrated a great degree of sportsmanship and was a great representative of MI club hockey.

Hats of to Bernie McBain and Minnesota Made Hockey for another incredibly smart move for Minnesota Youth Hockey! Bernie gets it.