Bantam A - up north

[Benito Juarez]

Correct that. 5-4 ot Warroad win

Is this team made up of all home grown talent?

.......

[HockeyDad41]

I watched the first period and part of the second. It was good back and forth classic northern hockey vs metro hockey, imo. The Warroad goalie played very well the first period and they got some good bounces in front of the net. I didn't think Warroad would be able to hang in there til the end with only 6 forwards and 4 d versus three solid lines of PL but they played tough and gritted out the win. Good to see a northern team win over a top ranked "state/metro" team. #2 PL was the best player I saw in this tourney. WAR has a few players moving to the area from Fort, Rainy, Duluth and Iowa the past two years. I would put Warroad and East Grand at the top of Northern teams. Should be a good game when these two play.

How does a northern hockey vs northern hockey or metro vs metro differ from northern hockey vs metro hockey?

[CreaseMonkey]

Championship

Sartell 5

Warroad 2

Sartell wasn't a flashy team but the games I watched them play they ran a nice forecheck and had solid, consisten blueliners. I don't think Bemidji had more than three quality shots the final two periods in the game earlier today.

Congrats Sartell.

I agree...Sartell played a solid game.
Warroad had nothing left in the tank after the game with Prior Lake and you could see the boys were wiped out from the start. 10 skaters can only do so much with 3 hours between games. Bemidji put on a great tournament.

[woodstick]

How does a northern hockey vs northern hockey or metro vs metro differ from northern hockey vs metro hockey?

Not sure there is a simple answer to your question. I guess from 25 years from watching Section 8 hockey you notice some things when you watch metro hockey. Its hard to explain but there just seems to be a different chemistry and atmosphere on the ice between northern and metro compared to metro vs metro and northern vs northern.

One thought is that many northern teams only roll two lines and have 2 maybe 3 good players and the team rallies around these players. Most metro teams spin 3 lines and those players are very equal because the pool of players avail. Exception of course to the elite teams that have the 1-2 elite players that the north maybe spits out only 1-2 a season all teams combined.

The really good players up north are developed from many hours spent rink ratting and playing pond and lake hockey and the really good players in metro develop from attending the specialized programs outside of association options. I think the northern rats learn more "creative" play. The first goal Warroad scored against PL, is a great example. North of hiway 10 there are more kids skating on lakes and ponds right now whereas the metro await for outside ice and bank on extra skill development learned in the summer while northern kids try to catch up.

I also think the northern teams tend to be a bit more physical.

The Fort folks I talked to in Bemidji were very impressed with the officiating as most of the time when they go deep south in MN to play, the games are called much tighter.

I am sure I have opened up a can of worms with the above statements but a few thoughts. Not saying one side is better than the other, I love seeing the metro vs north matchups and applaud the teams from the north that go on metro swings and the metro teams that go on northern swings.

One other comments is that there are more summer playing options for northern kids now which should help close down the gap. Yes, this has watered down 3A but gives kids opportunity to play they didn't have before

[woodstick]

Roseau Bantam A tourney on tap this weekend. Handful of top ranked teams heading north. Will be interesting to see how EGF does against Sibley and OMG. Predict they upset one of them.


http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/docu ... nament.pdf

[scorekeeper]

Roseau Bantam A tourney on tap this weekend. Handful of top ranked teams heading north. Will be interesting to see how EGF does against Sibley and OMG. Predict they upset one of them.


http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/docu ... nament.pdf

Wouldn't be much of an upset. #5 EGF is ranked higher than#9 Sibley (14.81 compared to 14.41) and should be a small favorite to beat the Generals and is considered no worse than 1/2 goal seperated from #3 OMG (15.40 to 14.81). A win by EGF in either game shouldn't be a surprise.

The team you don't want to take for granted in that Pool is Raleigh, North Carolina. The Tier 1 AAA entry from Carolina is actually the highest ranked team in the Pool at 15.87 and the second highest ranked team in the event, next to #1 Wayzata (16.47).

Strictly mathematical, the Pool shakes down like this;

1.) Carolina Hurricanes 15.87
2.) OMG 15.40
3.) EGF 14.81
4.) Sibley 14.41

Looks like Tourney organizers really wanted to stack the deck against EGF. Easily the most difficult Pool in the Tournament, representing 4 of the top 5 teams in the entire field, any one of those teams would be a favorite to win Pool C or D and Pool A is loaded with soft teams with the notable exception of #1 Wayzata.

Another interesting entry is the Pembina Valley team from Manitoba. They would compete well with second tier Minnesota 97 AAA teams (think Legacy, Machine Black), but not sure how well they will stack up against the top loaded '96 Minnesota Bantam A teams. They have some exceptional 97 players and should be fun to watch when they match up with #12 Rosemount and #10 Andover.

Those 2 Pools (B & C) are really up for grabs and any team can win.

For some reason, #1 Wayzata gets a walk, unchallenged in a very soft "A Pool" and will manhandle #45 Bemidji and #77 Roseau. The next toughest team in the Pool is the GF Wheat Kings and they would rank about #33rd stacked up to the Minnesota Bantam A teams.

Pool D is completely void of a top team ... #17 Farmington is as good as it gets and it drops a long way to #37 Chaska, followed by #63 TRF and a Fargo team which would have a hard time ranking in the top #50 in Minnesota.

Not much thought put into these brackets. Looks like they just pulled names out of a hat (which is how we did it in the old days btw, before we had the tools we have today). It would have been nice to see organizers do some homework and make more balanced brackets, but teams and players who are going up can take heart ... Roseau is one of the best places on the planet to play hockey, so once the puck drops - all of this won't matter much.

Have fun up there and good luck to all the teams and players!

[scorekeeper]

Speaking of Bantam A Up North, another great Tournament happening up North this weekend ...

Spirit of the Duluth, December 9-11

Red Pool

Thunder Bay (19- 8-1) 14.77
#16 Duluth East ( 7-11-2) 13.20
#18 Stillwater ( 9- 8-2) 13.00
#23 Blaine ( 8- 5-0) 12.40


The Red Pool is a very interesting mix of teams. Statistically, Thunder Bay looks to be the top team the Pool, but I think this is a case where the numbers of the Tier 1 teams, particulary in Ontario are skewed. There is not a lot of crossover between these teams and Minnesota Bantam A teams, and the early trend this season is that the Tier 1 teams (and particulary Ontario AAA teams) are scoring higher than they *should* be relative to Minnesota Bantam A teams. We saw the phenomina most recently with Shattuck St. Mary's, who played an early season schedule heavy in Minnesota Bantam A teams. This schedule kept them down in the Tier 1 rankings, simply because Minnesota bantam A (Tier II Hockey) is not scored as highly as Tier 1 AAA. However, once Shattuck started playing other Tier 1 AAA teams they began to rise in the standings. This is an error in assesment of the Minnesota Bantam A teams overall strength, which I believe is under-appreciated compared to their Tier 1 counterparts. Long story short - Tier 1 teams are mathematically over-rated and Minnesota bantam A teams are mathematically under-rated, so when the two meet, expectations should be tempered that in m ind. In this Pool, while Thunder Bay looks to be 1 1/2 goals better than Duluth and Stillwater and 2 1/2 goals better than Blaine, I would suggest that Thunder Bay is more realistically average for this pool and will have all they can handle and then some against every team in this Pool.

In examining Thunder Bay's competitive results with the Winnipeg AAA teams, it's reasonable to suggest they compare well to Minnesota Bantam A teams ranked in the 10-25 range, which is right in the wheelhouse for this Pool.

Another interesting dynamic is Stillwater's propensity to rise to the challenge. While they have put out a lot of mediocre results against average teams this season, they have also put out some of the most spectacular wins of the season, including the win over Edina at the Centennial preview and the win over the host team at Eden Prairie's First Test of the Best. I wouldn't be surprised to see Stillwater lose or tie Blaine and Thunder Bay and then beat Duluth East to upset the apple cart.

Duluth East is a team who has played one of the most difficult schedules in the State, so they are definitely ready for anything they face in this Tournament and they are the host team.

In a winner-take-all Pool I give the edge here to Duluth East, but watch out for those pesky Ponies!

Winner: Duluth East
Second: Thunder Bay


Green Pool

#13 Minnetonka ( 7- 4-5) 13.68
Madison ( 6-11-1) 12.37
#29 Hermantown ( 7- 7-0) 11.85
#32 St. Cloud (12- 5-2) 11.18

It looks like Minnetonka has a good draw here, but I believe St. Cloud is the dark horse. They match up pretty well with Minnetonka and won't shy away from a physical game, which suits them well, and they put a lot of pucks in the net. In fact, the Huskies have strung together 4 straight wins and they have knocked off teams already this season close to Minnetonka's caliber, including a 3-2 decision over Farmington.

Hermantown is another team you can't discount, as they have played tough games with quality opponents, losing to Burnsville 6-3, Duluth East 4-3 and Rosemount 7-5. They still haven't pulled out a big win, however.

With regards to Madison, see above (Re: Tier 1 rankings). Without the Team Wisconsin players, the Capitols are in tough here in Minnesota and should struggle in this Pool.

Winner: Minnetonka
Second: St. Cloud


White Pool

# 7 Burnsville (13- 2-5) 14.65
#11 Woodbury ( 9- 3-1) 13.91
#20 Centennial ( 4-13-2) 12.97
Marquette (16-14-5) 10.53

This is a tough draw for the Sentinals from Marquette. While Duluth organizers did a terrific job of balancing these Pools, this one is still the toughest one with both Burnsville and Woodbury in it.

Probably some unfinished business for Burnsville, who may be seeking a meassure of revenge after losing the championship game of thier home tournament to Woodbury on Thanksgiving weekend. The two teams should meet with the Pool on the line in the Saturday night game.

That said, watch out for Centennial. They have had a rough go this season so far. Being the weakest member of the Maroon and Gold League they have taken their share of lumps playing a very difficult schedule. But that's how you get better and I believe Centennial is experiencing that, evidenced by a recent win over Duluth East, competitive ties with Eastview and Burnsville and close losses to Wayzata, Eden Prairie and WBL.

Still, the clear favorite in my mind is Burnsville, who are a bend-don't-break team that can play with any Bantam team in the country. Through 20 games this season, they have only lost twice. Impressive, considering they have played a schedule which includes Wayzata, Edina, Duluth, Centennial, Minnetonka, Sibley and Farnington. The worrisome news, of course, the only two losses they do have on the season have both come at the hands of Woodbury. That said, we've often heard "the most difficult thing in sports is to beat a team 3 times". We'll see.

Winner: Burnsville
Second: Centennial


Blue Pool

# 6 WBL (14-5-3) 14.74
#25 Cloquet ( 5-3-0) 12.26
#33 Sartell (10-2-0) 11.16
#50 Orono ( 3-3-3) 9.82

The Sartell Sabres, who have lost only 2 games this season, are fresh off a Northern Minnesota Tournament Championship where they bested a field which included #8 Prior Lake and a talented Warroad squad, whome Sartell beat 5-2 in the Championship game. To repeat the feat they will have to overcome a Pool which includes another top 10 team, WBL and a very difficult Cloquet squad. At the risk of being a negative Nancy, I would bet against that happening.

Cloquet is a feast or famine team who either bring it or they don't. The big win for them this season was fresh out of the gate in a 6-2 win over Centennial. However, it's been famine since then in games against quality opponents, getting outscored 22-5 in three games against Wayzata, Eden Prairie and Duluth East. They should do alright against Orono and get a competitive game with Sartell, but WBL is in a league of it's own in this Pool.

The Bears have a bit of a split-personality. The Bears seem to do "just enough" no matter who they are playing. A 3-2 win over Blaine, 4-0 over Tartan, 6-5 win over Centennial, 2-2 with Farmington and most recent 2-2 with Lakeville North is all pretty unimpressive for an aspiring Top 5 team. But also on their resume is 2 wins over #4 Eden Prairie and 2 wins over #3 OMG. Still, whichever WBL team shows up, it has to be noted that they do get the job done, albeit not so pretty all the time. Expect more of the same in this Pool, with WBL wins, maybe by lower margins than expected.

Winner: White Bear Lake
Second: Sartell


Championship Bracket

Duluth vs Minnetonka
Burnsville vs White Bear Lake

Should be two great games, but both Minnetonka and WBL are beginning to hit stride and should be headed for a fantastic re-match of the 3-2 OT thriller they treated us to on Thanksgiving Weekend.

Championship Game

Minnetonka vs White Bear Lake

Tonka is tough, playing real well and will give WBL all they can handle, but the Bears are due to break through and there is no more deserving team in the State right now than WBL. They bring the hard work game in and game out and rarely take a shift off and they should be rewarded by bringing home the hardware this weekend!

Winner: White Bear Lake

[scorekeeper]

Best wishes to all teams and all players in both Tournaments Up North this weekend!

[woodstick]

Wouldn't be much of an upset. #5 EGF is ranked higher than#9 Sibley (14.81 compared to 14.41) and should be a small favorite to beat the Generals and is considered no worse than 1/2 goal seperated from #3 OMG (15.40 to 14.81). A win by EGF in either game shouldn't be a surprise.

The team you don't want to take for granted in that Pool is Raleigh, North Carolina. The Tier 1 AAA entry from Carolina is actually the highest ranked team in the Pool at 15.87 and the second highest ranked team in the event, next to #1 Wayzata (16.47).

The rankings I looked at didn't have EGF that high and your rankings were posted after I posted. I think they are top 10 but like you said in other thread, this tournament should show what type of team they as Bantams after high ranking as PWA.


Raleigh beat Moorhead 2-0 this evening.

[Zebos]

Raleigh beat Moorhead 2-0 this evening.

Good fast game. Moorhead outshot Raleigh but just couldn't beat their goalie.

[defense]

I watched the first period and part of the second. It was good back and forth classic northern hockey vs metro hockey, imo. The Warroad goalie played very well the first period and they got some good bounces in front of the net. I didn't think Warroad would be able to hang in there til the end with only 6 forwards and 4 d versus three solid lines of PL but they played tough and gritted out the win. Good to see a northern team win over a top ranked "state/metro" team. #2 PL was the best player I saw in this tourney. WAR has a few players moving to the area from Fort, Rainy, Duluth and Iowa the past two years. I would put Warroad and East Grand at the top of Northern teams. Should be a good game when these two play.

How does a northern hockey vs northern hockey or metro vs metro differ from northern hockey vs metro hockey?

Can't argue with anything said earlier. At all.
My 2 cents:

Once you get to that hi way 210 line and north, hockey tends to be a little rougher. Further north you go, rougher it is. Generally, closer to the Twin Cities, more finesse, puck control, pass, pass, pass, pretty moves, more north= "we're gonna go out and play hockey", hard nosed, get it done...somehow. Whatever it takes. In my day, north teams tended to dump and chase quite a bit, have a physical, if chaotic forcheck, and defensman just waiting for someone to hack the goalie, or try and beat them into their corners.
Further up north, players tended to finish out their checks, even after the whistle. A good northern team may not have excellent athletes on the team, but if they have good coaches, they are great hockey players.
In my opinion, a "metro" team, or closer to the metro tends to have more true athletes. I said before more finesse in their play. They seem to have a system set up for the entire game.
Teams closer to the 210 line seem to have a bit of an identity crisis. They may play a tournement with TC teams and then have regular games up north. A lot of times they may get sucked into thinking that they have to match the TC team they are playing against in pretty plays or skating ability. They go further north and get beat up a bit unless they stand their ground.
Or this was the case when I played, it wasn't that long ago though.

[YouthHockeyHub]

Scorekeeper,

Your previews are fantastic. Thanks for posting this. I can tell you spent a lot of time on these. I can only imagine how many Bantam A parents have read your posts.

With your permission, I'd love to re-post this to our website. This is precisely the great information our readers are looking for. Your anonymity can be as secure as you choose.

Please contact me via email to discuss: editor@youthhockeyhub.com to discuss.


Tony Scott
[/url]

[YouthHockeyHub]

Roseau Bantam A tourney on tap this weekend. Handful of top ranked teams heading north. Will be interesting to see how EGF does against Sibley and OMG. Predict they upset one of them.


http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/docu ... nament.pdf

Wouldn't be much of an upset. #5 EGF is ranked higher than#9 Sibley (14.81 compared to 14.41) and should be a small favorite to beat the Generals and is considered no worse than 1/2 goal seperated from #3 OMG (15.40 to 14.81). A win by EGF in either game shouldn't be a surprise.

The team you don't want to take for granted in that Pool is Raleigh, North Carolina. The Tier 1 AAA entry from Carolina is actually the highest ranked team in the Pool at 15.87 and the second highest ranked team in the event, next to #1 Wayzata (16.47).

Strictly mathematical, the Pool shakes down like this;

1.) Carolina Hurricanes 15.87
2.) OMG 15.40
3.) EGF 14.81
4.) Sibley 14.41

Looks like Tourney organizers really wanted to stack the deck against EGF. Easily the most difficult Pool in the Tournament, representing 4 of the top 5 teams in the entire field, any one of those teams would be a favorite to win Pool C or D and Pool A is loaded with soft teams with the notable exception of #1 Wayzata.

Another interesting entry is the Pembina Valley team from Manitoba. They would compete well with second tier Minnesota 97 AAA teams (think Legacy, Machine Black), but not sure how well they will stack up against the top loaded '96 Minnesota Bantam A teams. They have some exceptional 97 players and should be fun to watch when they match up with #12 Rosemount and #10 Andover.

Those 2 Pools (B & C) are really up for grabs and any team can win.

For some reason, #1 Wayzata gets a walk, unchallenged in a very soft "A Pool" and will manhandle #45 Bemidji and #77 Roseau. The next toughest team in the Pool is the GF Wheat Kings and they would rank about #33rd stacked up to the Minnesota Bantam A teams.

Pool D is completely void of a top team ... #17 Farmington is as good as it gets and it drops a long way to #37 Chaska, followed by #63 TRF and a Fargo team which would have a hard time ranking in the top #50 in Minnesota.

Not much thought put into these brackets. Looks like they just pulled names out of a hat (which is how we did it in the old days btw, before we had the tools we have today). It would have been nice to see organizers do some homework and make more balanced brackets, but teams and players who are going up can take heart ... Roseau is one of the best places on the planet to play hockey, so once the puck drops - all of this won't matter much.

Have fun up there and good luck to all the teams and players!

See Post Above....this is great stuff, would love to re-post with your permission (editor@youthhockeyhub.com)

[scorekeeper]

See Post Above....this is great stuff, would love to re-post with your permission (editor@youthhockeyhub.com)

no problem at all. feel free to re-post

[Bauer all the way]

Who are the top 10 Bantam A teams in D11, 12, 15 & 16?

I'd say the top team is EGF. 5 returning 2nd years an. From last years team and all 2nd years except for 3 players.

[puckhead58]

1. Moorhead
2. EGF
3-4. DuluthEast
3-4.Hermantown
5. Cloquet
6. Warroad
7. Bemidji