Nimrod wrote:BSM over EP; Centennial over Tonka and Maple Grove over Hopkins. Wild night in 6AA. The plot thickens!
No kidding!
Thursday night results: BSM 4, EP 2 Centennial 1, Tonka 0
Hopkins 2, Maple Grove 3 (OT)
Going into tonight, I would have guessed:
1. Hopkins
2. Minnetonka (hanging onto No. 2, barely)
3. BSM (almost No. 2)
4. Wayzata (solid No. 4)
5. Maple Grove
6. Armstrong/Cooper
7. North Metro
After tonight, I would guess:
1. BSM
2. Hopkins
3. Wayzata ?
3. Minnetonka ?
3. Maple Grove ?
6. Armstrong/Cooper
7. North Metro
BSM needs to beat Irondale on Friday to be assured of No. 1. If they don't, I would think Hopkins will retain the No. 1 seed, despite losing to Maple Grove tonight. Meanwhile, the order of Nos. 3-5 is hard to predict. Thoughts?
KRACH says this AM:
1 Benilde-St. Margaret's 19-2-1 663.824 AA 6
2 Hopkins 21-4-0 605.467 AA 6
4 Minnetonka 16-5-2 465.553 AA 6
6 Wayzata 17-6-1 343.102 AA 6
12 Maple Grove 16-5-2 163.879 AA 6
22 Robbinsdale Armstrong/Cooper 13-8-2 60.462 AA 6
85 North Metro 2-21-0 1.701 AA 6
108 St. Louis Park 3-18-1 0.241 AA 6
Nimrod wrote:I do have a dog in this fight, but if BSM does manage to beat the Lake Conference Champ twice on the road (including at the end of the season when there should be no excuses) and still ends up behind Tonka and/or Hopkins, then its time to call BS! You cannot say you are the best and then have your Champ lose twice at home to someone else with only two losses on the season and ignore that. And if rumors are true that one and/or both refused to play BSM this year, then…(insert your own thoughts here). Now that i have all the Lake Conference Dads rooting for EP, I will hang up. Good stuff! Its fun to have the last couple games mean something regardless of what happens. Lets all hope the teams that deserve to move on are the ones that do. Although i am pretty sure there is no wrong answer when it comes to 6AA so long as the girls are allowed to decide the outcome.
Going to OT with MV and TG in the last few weeks might hurt BSM a bit remember this is subjective and not a math equation. As far as last year goes I think the championship game showed that they were even teams with a slight edge to Tonka. The couple times I saw BSM last year it didn't seem like BSM line matched much so I don't know how the 2nd seed hurt them. I dont know that the BSM vs EP game means much to EP, they won the conference and probably have the 1 seed locked.
I think you could argue a number of scenarios but getting stuck with an opening game v Maple Grove or Armstrong is really where seeding comes in. If you look past either team I think they could surprise any of the top 4. In some sections I think Maple Grove is a 2 seed and Armstrong a 3.
Agreeing with Royals Dad too much lately, good points and if you look at the two ranking systems (Krach & QRF) MG would be the #1 seed in section 3, both MG and AC would be the #1 seed in sections 7 & 8 if either of them were in that section.
I don't want to start a whole the Metro thinks it the only place hockey is played debate again. Strictly speaking as a fan of the game, future parent of a HS player (few years away yet), and the long term development of the sport that is still in it's developing years it seems a shame that so many good teams are in one section. While that section tourney will be great, I for one would like to see 1 or more of those games played on a bigger stage, for future generations of the game to see. I'll get off my soap box now and go shovel some snow.
Barring an upset by Edina on Saturday, 6AA will not have the #1 team in AA in their section. And while it IS the deepest section and has been the best section in state the last 6 or 7 years, you'd be surprised how close 4AA is. I think in games won at state, it's a difference of one or two games in the last 7 years (looked it up earlier this year). And that's with Tonka being 9-0 the last 3 years. All I'm pointing out is that there will be good teams at state from other sections that could very well hold the trophy at the end. EP and Edina also will have a lot to say as will Lakeville North who almost did it last year.
Nimrod wrote: Just hope the doctors got it right as the issue with that is an enlarged spleen that could be life threatening if you simply stumble and fall down. Hockey is not that important.
And we all bow down to the finley honed inuendo skills of a BSM Girls Hockey parent.
No clue what that means Royals Dad. If you are suggesting there was a hidden message in there, you are way out of bounds! I was merely publicly noting with great relief for a young lady that she didn't have to sit out the season and that a young lady's health is far important than hockey games even though us hockey parents sometimes forget that. We went through that issue with our daughter and she was not so fortuante in dodging that bullet so it hit kind of close to home. Maybe I should have worded it in a different order but I think only someone looking for trouble would read it your way. I am sorry your team lost last night but shame on you for turning what was intended to be a postive post supporting our general hockey community into a negative.
Nimrod said..Just hope the doctors got it right as the issue with that is an enlarged spleen that could be life threatening if you simply stumble and fall down. Hockey is not that important.[/quote]
Nimrod, I think Royals dad just meant that I am sure the doctors and and the Bizals are doing whats best for Grace and probably do not need to be reminded that hockey is not as important as their daughter dying and I am positive the Bizals (hockey parents) haven't "forgot" that.
Just curious, what does Hopkins losing last night have to do with RD's comments?
By the way BSM has earned the #1 seed and with 6 D1 girls and a 7th soon to sign on your roster. I would argue that anything less than a State Championship would be awfully disappointing.
Probably would have been better if he had said that then. I have no doubt they would place their daughter's health first and anyone that is trying to suggest they wouldn't or that I was suggesting that needs to get a life and stop looking for trouble. I perhaps incorrectly assumed he was attacking me because he was upset about them losing. I will take the hit on that and apologize. Also, RD, a sincere congrats to your daughter for the recognition she received last night. She deserves it and don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
As for the rest, BSM had a far better team last year and didn't get the job done. Lots of things come into play in one and done scenarios including the heart of the other team(s). The #1 Seed is not a done deal even if they win tonight even though it probably should be. And winning even one Section game is far from certain unless you get a first round bye. No one is going to hand anyone anything so setting them up for failure if they don't win it all is disengenious. A week ago I thought 6AA was a 4 team race, now I say its a 6 team race and nothing can be assumed. There are lots of great players on all the teams (including at least 10 teams that are not in 6AA) and it will come down to who shows up on a given night just like it always does.
Nimrod, I would say that it is a 6 team race, but one of the 4-6 teams would have to get very hot and win not 1, not 2, but 3 very tough games. Hey, if #6 beats #3, #2, and #1, they've earned it, but what a monumental task. Can it be done? Of course. MG could certainly do it the way they're playing now. It could come down to some puck luck as tight as some of these games will undoubtedly be. Is it more likely that one of the 4-6 teams makes it to State over the 1-3 teams? Not very, if you go with the odds. Note that I'm not assuming anything.
BSM did have a better team last year, but so did Tonka. BSM and Tonka are down a bit this year, but everyone else is up. Would agree wtih 36G that with so many D1 players and to not win State would be a disappointment. It doesn't mean that the season was a failure, but you know they'll be hurting. I think Tonka would have been sorely disappointed had they not won State last year with >=8 D1 players. With so many great teams, all it takes is one stumble for any of them and the dream is crushed. In any event, I agree with Nimrod again that it will be a section to watch the likes of which we'll probably not see again.
Fair points Sinbin. Bottom line is regardless of how the seeding plays out, this year it truly is wide open. No one can assume anything because there is no dominant team. Its a tougher road for the lower seeds as you say, but a hot goalie and a couple breaks here and there can turn into a three game streak that finds you at State. And even the top two seeds have no more than one easier game (i.e., a bye or the 7 seed). After that I would not put money on anyone. For sure the toughest section this year. And whats up with MG? Someone needs to tell them to wake up! They scare me.
Nimrod wrote:And whats up with MG? Someone needs to tell them to wake up!
Nimrod, I think they're wide awake! It's a pretty safe bet that the Crimson have captured the attention of the rest of the section's coaches.
Like they always say, it's at the end of the season when you want to be playing your best hockey, and right now there is no better example of that than Maple Grove.
Not so sure if they are "faltering". I realize their records over the last few games aren't what they are accustomed to but look at who they have been playing. Very tough teams including the Lake Conference beasts. And MG has clearly stepped up and even a loss to Centennial isn't necessarily a falter. I recall Centennial scored 1 goal on 9 shots to win. Obvioulsy a game that could have easily gone the other way. And Centennial is a big, gritty team whom I actually thought would have a much better record right now. They gave BSM fits in the Fall scrimmage fest but then again hard to put much value in those games. There is simply a great deal of parity out there this season.
Back to the Section, I heard Brad Frost on KFAN today say he wishes they could fix this section as it "hinders the State tournament when 5 of the top 10 are in one section". Pretty close to a quote, might have gotten a couple words out of order again. Not looking for trouble here, just noting we aren't the only ones that notice.
Nimrod wrote:Not so sure if they are "faltering". I realize their records over the last few games aren't what they are accustomed to but look at who they have been playing. Very tough teams including the Lake Conference beasts.
Their team defense and goaltending remain stellar, but for some reason their OFFENSE has practically disappeared as of late. They are just having a hard time scoring goals. In the 8 games played during the month of January they've scored a grand total of 11, and in three of those games they've been shut out (including two of their last three). They will obviously need to pick it up in sections if they have any hope of making it to State and try to make it four straight championships. To get there I think they'll need to score at least twice in each of the section games. If they do their stout defense may well be good enough for them to again win the section.
Just heard the Hopkins coach (Vin Paolucci) on KSTP-AM, making his best case for his team as deserving of the No. 1 seed! I think it SHOULD come down to either Hopkins or Benilde. Possibly tipping the scales in favor of BSM are the two games each of them played against EP - Hopkins lost to them twice where BSM beat them both times, and then Hopkins losing to Maple Grove in their last game could be looked at as a "worse loss" than Benilde's recent loss to Hill-Murray. But in their favor BSM lost to Edina the one time they played each other whereas Hopkins and Edina split their two games.
It sure would be interesting to witness the upcoming coaches meeting in person to see how they sort it all out.
With my red-colored glasses on, I think BSM deserves the top seed by a hair over Hopkins. You have to go by common opponents when you don't play each other. Hopkins is 6-3 with a total goal differential of +11 (1.22/gm). BSM is 6-1-1 with a goal differential of +16. (2 per game). I would submit that should be good enough.
Do I think there's a whole lot of difference between the top teams? Not really, but you have to separate them somehow and this would appear to be the fairest way.
I think it would be hard to justify giving the number 1 seed to a team that finished 1-3 compared to a team that finished 3-1, particularly when the rest of the season records don't give the edge to Hopkins either. Yes the losses were close and the wins for BSM were close as well but all wins and losses were against quality teams so not sure how you can ignore that. I would agree there is a lot of parity and i wouldn't put money on either team coming out on top in the section over each other or at least 3 others but at some point the facts speak for themselves. Had BSM played Hopkins and/or Tonka maybe the decision would be obvious to everyone but we don't have that so all you can do is compare common opponents, which brings you back to EP winning the Lake Conference and BSM beating that Conference champ twice on the road including a 4-2 win just 3 days ago. I for one would be very interested in hearing how the Hopkins coach sees it differently. It does tell us though that its a subjective process and can swing wildly. Maybe they will decide MG or Tonka should be number one. Should be interesting to hear the results and I agree it would be interesting to see how each coach postures for their team. And maybe these decisions will motive someone who gets the shaft to play harder and propel them to the next level. I for one just hope it ends up the way it should if it were decided by 7 or 8 people with no dogs in the fight. I think we could all get behind that.
Don't have a dog in the fight but with that schedule I find it funny to think that 7 public schools are going to hand benilde the #1 seed. They didn't play Hopkins, maple grove, tonka, or Armstrong.
With that said I bet tonka would rather see Hopkins the two seed. And I bet maple grove/wayzata would rather see Hopkins the 1 seed.
Our girls played the top teams at least twice each. BSM is the best of those 3 IMHO. They're all real good, but BSM is a little better. I know our girls want one more crack at them.
Comparing results of common Lake Conference games - BSM comes out ahead overall. Not sure what more the BSM girls could do to get the #1 seed. Unfortunate that there is no head to head comparison. Will be interesting to see what's decided...
Based on these results, it will be interesting to hear the conspiracy theories come out from some.
But I do have a question on the #1 seed with the bye. Since whatever team advances to State will need to defeat two or three very tough teams, is it an advantage or disadvantage for Hopkins to have a bye the first game? More time to rest and practice and less chance of injury vs. perhaps taking on a few cobwebs and immediately jumping into the fray without a playoff "warmup" game (although only one first round game would qualify as such), although many teams have one regular season game remaining.
"By the way BSM has earned the #1 seed and with 6 D1 girls and a 7th soon to sign on your roster. I would argue that anything less than a State Championship would be awfully disappointing."
I am not surprised with the outcome but would still like to know how they came to that conclusion. Would it have ended the same way if BSM went undefeated? The good news, with the bye in play and barring a major upset, there is an additional game for me to watch my daughter play before her HS career ends. Good luck to all the teams. Regardless of the seedings, it will be another wild time in 6AA!
Ironically, Hopkins now faces in their first game the winner of the only two teams in the section that beat them this year. Guess that could be taken two ways (not good or motivate them). I am guessing the latter.
Nimrod wrote:Ironically, Hopkins now faces in their first game the winner of the only two teams in the section that beat them this year. Guess that could be taken two ways (not good or motivate them). I am guessing the latter.
First they'll have to get past Bye! Then, whichever team they get in the semi, whether it's Maple Grove or Wayzata, you know for sure that if they should lose it won't be because they took them lightly. So I completely agree that either matchup would be a big motivator for them.
It's a pretty safe bet that the Crimson have captured the attention of the rest of the section's coaches. 
Then, whichever team they get in the semi, whether it's Maple Grove or Wayzata, you know for sure that if they should lose it won't be because they took them lightly. So I completely agree that either matchup would be a big motivator for them.